Dignity

What are your thoughts on the concept of dignity?

I want to leave this as an open question before narrowing it down. This topic comes to mind because of some comments made elsewhere on the forum about manners. I think an extension in thought can be made but would like to hear what you think

Do members of this forum find being treated with dignity by others to be important to them?

I don't know about people with ASPD, but most healthy people are highly motivated by preserving their dignity.

I say healthy people because there are others who gravitate towards the victim-abuser dynamic

And/or think the pay-off of being treated half decent after some covert or overt abuse is better than the stability of dignified treatment <- which is also a pretty good push-pull tactic for those seeking popularity in groups of people with little insight.

Most people will tolerate more from others if they know the other person is not consciously attacking their dignity.

That's a good questions Datura

I had hoped for some more personal perspectives in this thread before looking to generalise. Might you write on how dignity plays a role in your life, whether maintaining it for yourself or others?

wats the dif between and respect?

as I said in other thread I care for ppl who care for me. respect tho? err i only really respect those who can play me at my own games.

dignity? err idk I'm kind to people and polite etc. but it's not that deep until it becomes respect which I just explained who I respect.

-- Fri Oct 04, 2019 2:27 am --

im not offended if someone's indignant i usually blame it on the person but obv I like being respected. doesn't make me respect them back tho.

solemnlysworn wrote:That's a good questions Datura

I had hoped for some more personal perspectives in this thread before looking to generalise. Might you write on how dignity plays a role in your life, whether maintaining it for yourself or others?

It's saved my @ss a couple of times.
I do dumb/niave sh1t, but don't get punished because it's obvious my motives are good.

As for when my dignity is impacted, I bypass rational thought, "hurt feelings" and go straight over to anger and needing to "get my dignity back"

I'm not a fan of personalizing, but I'll give an extreme example.
To give context, it's important to note that I'm a gentle-natured person. 

I was driving on a highway one evening, and when the 2 lanes were merging, a car with 2 young men quickly drove up beside me and looked like they were going to crash into me to come into my lane.
I swerved and almost went off the road.
When I looked over, the driver boy was looking at me and laughing. 

This impacted my dignity because I interpreted it as him doing it on purpose to fuk with me.

I got angry and sped up before the lane ended so they were behind me and then started randomly jamming on my brakes.
After having to avoid rear-ending me a couple times, they decided to pass me.
Then I followed them until the next town where they stopped at a gas station.
I parked beside them and I got out of the car screaming at the driver boy.

He was semi-submissive (mostly due to shock of some dumb, crazy b1tch acting the way I was), so I felt I got my dignity back and got back in my car to leave.

Then he put his head out his window and spit on my car.
My dignity felt affected again, so I jumped out screaming and hitting his car.
I spit on his window and as he was backing up, I noticed his back window was opened so I spit directly into his car.
This gave me back my dignity (in my mind).

Openly behaving like that in a community I was known in, could have risked my reputation and my line of work.
Apparently, I was willing to forgo that so I could (in my mind) protect my dignity.
Moreover, I could have gotten the beating of a lifetime...

That being said, I was calculating my risks based on the driver boy's reaction to me (I think that may be what VCRPamplet would call me "dramatically posturing").
I knew not to fuk with the guy in the passenger seat based on his body language and reactions -  and he ignored me and laughed and went into the gas station store as I did all this.

If a little old lady/man almost ran me off the road, I'd probably have just waved, smiled and laughed. They wouldn't have been impacting my dignity.

In day to day life, I have been putting effort into remembering my self-respect isn't always the most important thing at hand.
Sometimes it's not getting fired, etc.

saucygirl31 wrote:wats the dif between and respect?

as I said in other thread I care for ppl who care for me. respect tho? err i only really respect those who can play me at my own games.

dignity? err idk I'm kind to people and polite etc. but it's not that deep until it becomes respect which I just explained who I respect.

-- Fri Oct 04, 2019 2:27 am --

im not offended if someone's indignant i usually blame it on the person but obv I like being respected. doesn't make me respect them back tho.

I'm not fully sure of the difference between respect and dignity, myself.

You've mentioned being court ordered to see therapists right?
And they're usually female?
Do they like you?
Do you try to flirt with them?
Can you charm them?

Misc thoughts -

Good word to ponder. Like all words, it is a label for something us humans feel, or believe. No word can entirely capture what it is, but it's rather amazing how many of us can agree on the meaning, even if we can't entirely nail it down.

Not sure I can put it into words either, or the words will be flawed, but dignity matters. Problem is dignity is like juggling plates, it doesn't take much to throw it off balance, even a heckler in the crowd can throw off a good juggler. Here is thing -

It's easy to not be able to juggle, it's a hard and rare thing when someone can juggle. Do we want to live in a world where there is no juggling because most of us can't, or a world where sometimes we see the later.

Dignity is an image, and fragile, but how badly do you do we want to live in a world where there is no sense of dignity (or jugglers)?

Tearing things down is easy. Building something outside our worst nature is hard.

The two are connected. Allow to try to tease out the difference before we revert to being philosophical without direction which seems to be happening recently.

Respect is only really about esteem. When you don't acknowledge somebody as they enter a room, it may be rude and if it were your superior they may think that it displays a lack of respect. It's about whether you are paying proper attention to their status (person or concept) and making considerations based on that.

It's useful to think about dignity in terms of the things that might breach dignity.
Dehumanisation, objectification, humiliation and degradation are all undignified. I might think that somebody is quite intelligent and admire that and offer great respect for their opinion. What that doesn't then do is mean that I will treat them with dignity or allow them dignity nor does it mean that they act in a dignified manner.

"I respect your opinion..." implies due consideration. "... but I'm not going to dignify that with response" implies lack of worth in what is being offered. Using the example before, you might very much respect somebody for something but that does not mean that you then think them dignified or allow them dignity.

solemnlysworn wrote:The two are connected. Allow to try to tease out the difference before we revert to being philosophical without direction which seems to be happening recently.

Respect is only really about esteem. When you don't acknowledge somebody as they enter a room, it may be rude and if it were your superior they may think that it displays a lack of respect. It's about whether you are paying proper attention to their status (person or concept) and making considerations based on that.

It's useful to think about dignity in terms of the things that might breach dignity.
Dehumanisation, objectification, humiliation and degradation are all undignified. I might think that somebody is quite intelligent and admire that and offer great respect for their opinion. What that doesn't then do is mean that I will treat them with dignity or allow them dignity.

"I respect your decision but..." implies due consideration. "I'm not going to dignify that with..." implies worth in what is being offered. Using the example before, you might very much respect somebody for something but that does not mean that you then think them dignified or allow them dignity.

Agree.

Good call out on Respect, it is a different word, and has a different meaning. Great explanation.

xdude wrote:Dignity is an image

No it's not the same thing as ego.

solemnlysworn wrote:The two are connected. Allow to try to tease out the difference before we revert to being philosophical without direction which seems to be happening recently.

Respect is only really about esteem. When you don't acknowledge somebody as they enter a room, it may be rude and if it were your superior they may think that it displays a lack of respect. It's about whether you are paying proper attention to their status (person or concept) and making considerations based on that.

It's useful to think about dignity in terms of the things that might breach dignity.
Dehumanisation, objectification, humiliation and degradation are all undignified. I might think that somebody is quite intelligent and admire that and offer great respect for their opinion. What that doesn't then do is mean that I will treat them with dignity or allow them dignity nor does it mean that they act in a dignified manner.

"I respect your opinion..." implies due consideration. "... but I'm not going to dignify that with response" implies lack of worth in what is being offered. Using the example before, you might very much respect somebody for something but that does not mean that you then think them dignified or allow them dignity.

Maybe give an example in the format your looking for

DaturaInnoxia wrote:

xdude wrote:Dignity is an image

No it's not the same thing as ego.

I don't have any final answer either, good though to bounce off others.

Perhaps dignity is about what we do over time vs ego, reacting in the moment?