Hearing voices or electronic harassment?

There are similarities between the Stasi and gang stalking.
Also when there were COINTELPRO hearings, the records were destroyed.
We believe that gang stalking is just the continuation of COINTELPRO.
(1) how you recruit each person: blackmail.
(2) how you keep someone in the group: by making them fear for their life and the lives of their relatives.
(3) how you keep them from talking to anyone: fear to become the next victim, make them sign a secret law that says that they will be executed if they talk. This is standard for secret services.
(4) how you keep anyone from knowing about what your doing: by storing your files in secret secure locations, control of the media.
(5) what the overall goals of your organization are: a police state wants as many informants as possible.
(6) what your budget is and where you get your money: black budgets (drug trafficking, prostitution, gambling, ...), some secret services don't have to tell government what they do with the tax money.

Cliff Huylebroeck wrote:(1) how you recruit each person: blackmail.
(2) how you keep someone in the group: by making them fear for their life and the lives of their relatives.
(3) how you keep them from talking to anyone: fear to become the next victim, make them sign a secret law that says that they will be executed if they talk. This is standard for secret services.
(4) how you keep anyone from knowing about what your doing: by storing your files in secret secure locations, control of the media.
(5) what the overall goals of your organization are: a police state wants as many informants as possible.
(6) what your budget is and where you get your money: black budgets (drug trafficking, prostitution, gambling, ...), some secret services don't have to tell government what they do with the tax money.

Okay so if we take (6) seriously your saying the gang stalkers are kind of like organized crime because they get their money from illegal activities? Yes?

There is not a single organized crime group that has escaped prosecution and all organized crime groups have had members cooperate with the police to either escape prosecution, avoid being killed or to lessen the penalty of a crime they have been caught for. This includes:

The Sicilian Mafia
The Hells Angels
The Columbian drug cartels
The Russian vory v zakone
etceterea

Why would you think your gang stalking group would be different?

Infinite_Jester wrote:

Squirrel1 wrote:(1) There exists a technology which uses electromagnetic energy to transmit whole meaningful sentences of the English language to target individual far distances away.
(2) An organization exists which uses the aforementioned technology on target individuals
(3) You are being targeted by the aforementioned organization with the aforementioned technology

Here's the situation.

Someone who would deny microwave voice to skull is impossible based on a report where the experimenter (Frey) WAS NOT TRANSMITTING VOICE is clearly someone with extreme bias, typical of psychiatric patients who have bought into the psychiatric nonsense, hook line and sinker.

Such a person deserves pity, and such a person's opinion does not merit attempting to respond to.

I will just say in closing that radar hearing is verifiable by many technicians who work in the vicinity of high power radar antennas. Radar pulses cause clicks in the hearing sense. It's not debateable.

I will just say in closing that since radar signal pulses produce a train of clicks, AND, voice can be synthesized from clicks, readily do-able using a small, inexpensive 555 timer circuit, which I have done in front of co-workers and they acknowledged that voice and music synthesized from simple clicks works very well, the synthesis of voice from radar pulse clicks can be demonstrated by others.

If you, Infinite Jester, want to keep on believing that microwave voice to skull doesn't work, and that people who hear voices need to be drugged and labelled as crazy, BE MY GUEST.

Cheerio

Hey Eleanor,

I think this was probably one of the most ruthless argument ad hominums I have every read. However, I want to show that even your rhetoric is false and illogical.

Squirrel1 wrote:
Someone who would deny microwave voice to skull is impossible based on a report where the experimenter (Frey) WAS NOT TRANSMITTING VOICE is clearly someone with extreme bias, typical of psychiatric patients who have bought into the psychiatric nonsense, hook line and sinker.

Let's look at what I wrote about other authors besides Frey:

anti-psych/topic52153-40.html

"In "Microwaves and Behaviour", the article that you cited [in the other thread], the author writes that:

" Communication has in fact been demonstrated. A. Guy (Note 1), a skilled telegrapher, arranged for his father, a retired railroad' telegrapher, to operate a key, each closure and opening of which resulted in radiation of a pulse of microwave energy. By directing the radiations at his own head, complex messages via the Continental Morse Code were readily received by Guy." (396) (Justesen, 1975).

They used the clicking noises that electromagnetic energy causes people to experience to give someone codes like "click click -pause- click -pause- click". Again this is not similar in anyway to hearing voices.

Furthermore, Sharp and Groove used no test subjects. Instead, they were able to train themselves to distinguish between the numbers 1-9 when played to themselves through electromagnetic energy. This only shows that the "clicks, buzzes, knocks" sound different depending on the original sound that is being transformed and that through extenisive training someone may be able to tell the difference between one "click" and a "buzz". Nowhere does this research indicate that electromagnetic energy can sound like a voice or communicate whole meaningful sentences of the English language to a test subject with no training."

***this cannot be quoted because you can only quote from one of the last few posts***

Therefore, it is not the case that my disbelief in voice to skull technology is only based on the unconvincing "clicks, buzzes and humms" produced by Frey. Instead, my disbelief is based on the fact that there is no evidence or reason to believe in technology that can communicate whole meaningful sentences of the English language with electromagnetic energy.

Squirrel1 wrote:It's not debateable.

If it's not debatable then it's a fact. Yes? Well lets look at the evidence:

Squirrel1 wrote:
radar hearing is verifiable by many technicians who work in the vicinity of high power radar antennas. Radar pulses cause clicks in the hearing sense. [ . . . ] radar signal pulses produce a train of clicks, AND, voice can be synthesized from clicks, readily do-able using a small, inexpensive 555 timer circuit, which I have done in front of co-workers and they acknowledged that voice and music synthesized from simple clicks works very well, the synthesis of voice from radar pulse clicks can be demonstrated by others.

To be clear: we're talking about a technology that operates across long distances. It's like a gun that shoots voices into people's heads. This technology doesn't operate by producing compressions and rarefactions of air that vibrates the inner ear. Instead, it operates using electromagnetic energy.

Your conflating the two types of stimulus. It is certainly possible to communicate whole meaningful sentences of the English language to someone by compressing and rarefying air molecules. However, it is impossible to communicate whole meaningful sentences of the English language with electromagnetic energy.

When you talk about making people hear things by producing clicking noises you need to specify if you are talking about moving air molecules (i.e. speakers that play music) or electromagnetic energy. Of course, voice to skull is purported to operate using the latter which has never been demonstrated to do anything other cause targets to hear "clicks, buzzes and humms".

Squirrel1 wrote:typical of psychiatric patients who have bought into the psychiatric nonsense, hook line and sinker. [. . . .] Such a person deserves pity, and such a person's opinion does not merit attempting to respond to. [ . . . ] If you, Infinite Jester, want to keep on believing that microwave voice to skull doesn't work, and that people who hear voices need to be drugged and labelled as crazy, BE MY GUEST.

When your only recourse is to insults and rhetoric it is clear that your position (the existence of voice to skull technology and gangsters who use it against you) is not defensible with reason or evidence. Instead of coming to disbelieve your claims you continue to imagine the nightmarish situation in which you your brain is under attack from predatory electronic gangsters.

Don't you want to believe me? That auditory hallucinations are the product of over-active dopaminerigic neurons and that there are things that you can do to feel better and live a life free from the daily nightmare and fear of being gang stalked. I'm trying to help you out Eleanor (and Cliff. We're becoming buddies ) but I need you to follow along with me as I explore the evidence and analyse the premises that support what your saying. That's really the only way out.

Sincerely,

-Senseless psychiatric patient who is unworthy of opinion

Infinite_Jester wrote:Hey Eleanor,
" Communication has in fact been demonstrated. A. Guy (Note 1), a skilled telegrapher, arranged for his father, a retired railroad' telegrapher, to operate a key, each closure and opening of which resulted in radiation of a pulse of microwave energy. By directing the radiations at his own head, complex messages via the Continental Morse Code were readily received by Guy." (396) (Justesen, 1975).

Here again, you are using PART of an article which does NOT describe voice transmission, but describes a different mode of transmission. You are clearly aware of what you are doing, and not someone who is confused or new to this subject.

It is blatantly obvious your purpose is to deny what has been proven to work, as opposed to discussing experiments where voice DID get transmitted.

I say again - whatever your motive is, you can keep on believing what you want. I don't care. You are a total zero in the effort to expose and stop a serious crime.

For others reading this post, pulsed microwave voice to skull has been demonstrated.

Squirrel1 wrote:pulsed microwave voice to skull has been demonstrated.

Evidence?

Please don't cite Sharp and Grove... for the oumpf-tenth time:

Sharp and Groove used no test subjects. Instead, they were able to train themselves to distinguish between the numbers 1-9 when played to themselves through electromagnetic energy. This only shows that the "clicks, buzzes, knocks" sound different depending on the original sound that is being transformed and that through extenisive training someone may be able to tell the difference between one "click" and a "buzz". Nowhere does this research indicate that electromagnetic energy can sound like a voice or communicate whole meaningful sentences of the English language to a test subject with no training. (Justesen, 1975)

Please take care.

For what it's worth, speech transmission was one of the capabilites discussed at a conference session I attended about the social implications of non-lethal weapons, and nobody challenged the claim, not even the American colonel who spoke last, and who was asked by a journalist in the room whether these capabilities existed, and admitted that they did.

Isn't there an entry in some army dictionary or other mentioning "voice to skull"?

Where can I read online the 1975 report of speech transmission by Sharp and Grove? I remember reading it in a university library about ten years ago, and I remember it as claiming recognisable speech, not that the experimental subjects, the experimenters themselves, learned to recognise ten different patterns of clicks and buzzes, as is now being claimed here. I'd like to read the article again. Or can anybody quote the relevant bit?

Infinite_Jester wrote:

Squirrel wrote:pulsed microwave voice to skull has been demonstrated.

Evidence?

Please don't cite Sharp and Grove... for the oumpf-tenth time:

Sharp and Groove used no test subjects. Instead, they were able to train themselves to distinguish between the numbers 1-9 when played to themselves through electromagnetic energy. This only shows that the "clicks, buzzes, knocks" sound different depending on the original sound that is being transformed and that through extenisive training someone may be able to tell the difference between one "click" and a "buzz". Nowhere does this research indicate that electromagnetic energy can sound like a voice or communicate whole meaningful sentences of the English language to a test subject with no training. (Justesen, 1975)

Sharp WAS the test subject, and he heard SPOKEN NUMBERS.

"Sharp and Grove found that appropriate modulation of microwave energy can result in direct 'wireless' and 'receiverless' communication of SPEECH."

Got that? SPEECH.

"The sounds were not unlike those emitted by persons with artificial larynxes."

In other words, artificial sounding speech, but speech nonetheless.

And even with only clicks from radar pulses being heard, it is easily demonstrated that simple clicks can synthesize voice and music. So anyone taking the trouble to synthesize speech from clicks will know that it is do-able. I have done that myself.

And I spoke with Dr. Justesen by telephone and he confirmed to me that SPEECH WAS HEARD by Sharp when Sharp acted as a test subject.

You are trying very hard to convince readers of this board that there is no such thing as microwave voice to skull. I know that open-minded people have no problem at all understanding that Sharp heard SPEECH. Even police officers I have shared the info with accepted that speech can be transmitted.

Your purpose, regardless of motive, is to discredit targets of a crime which includes forced voice transmissions. I don't care what you believe or don't believe. I am only posting for the others.

To the others - this person's behaviour fits what is known as "disinformation" - deliberately attempting to convey false information knowingly. I suggest an honest reading of his voluminous posts show that plainly. Such posts do not deserve your taking them seriously.

Sceptic wrote:For what it's worth, speech transmission was one of the capabilites discussed at a conference session I attended about the social implications of non-lethal weapons, and nobody challenged the claim, not even the American colonel who spoke last, and who was asked by a journalist in the room whether these capabilities existed, and admitted that they did.

Isn't there an entry in some army dictionary or other mentioning "voice to skull"?

Where can I read online the 1975 report of speech transmission by Sharp and Grove? I remember reading it in a university library about ten years ago, and I remember it as claiming recognisable speech, not that the experimental subjects, the experimenters themselves, learned to recognise ten different patterns of clicks and buzzes, as is now being claimed here. I'd like to read the article again. Or can anybody quote the relevant bit?

Although the U.S. Army pulled the voice to skull entry from their on-line thesaurus circa 2007, a screen shot of their post is available here:

http://www.randomcollection.info/armyv2k.gif

The U.S. Army chose "K" instead of "S" - perhaps they already had a meaning for V2S that conflicted.

The relevant portion of the Justesen article about Sharp's successful demonstration of SPEECH transmission by pulsed microwave is here:

http://www.randomcollection.info/ampsychv2s.pdf

If the typeface is too small for comfort (the original was light and hard to scan) use the PDF viewer's zoom feature to make it more readable.

** Just a personal side comment here. Infinite Jester's incredibly aggressive and evasive disinformation makes me wonder if he thinks he's "defending" the psychiatric system, particularly patients, against the knowledge that not all "hearing voices" is necessarily from a natural medical condition. Just think about the stakes for the psychiatric establishment if patients generally knew that there is another possibility for the voices they hear.

Hey Eleanor,

Here's the full quote from "Microwaves and Behavior"

"Sharp and Grove (Note 2) found that appropriate modulation of microwave energy can result in direct "wireless" and "receiverless" communication of speech. They recorded by voice on tape each of the single-syllable words for digits between 1 and 10. The electrical sine-wave analo'gs of each word were then processed so that each time a sine wave crossed zero reference in the negative direction, a brief pulse of microwave energy was triggered. By radiating themselves with these "voicemodulated" microwaves, Sharp and Grove were readily able to hear, identify, and distinguish among the 9 words. The sounds heard were not unlike those emitted by persons with artificial larynxes. Communication of more complex words and of sentences was not attempted because the averaged densities of energy required to transmit longer messages would approach the current 10 mW/cm 2 limit of safe exposure. The capability of communicating directly with a human being by "receiverless radio" has obvious potentialities both within and without the clinic. But the hotly debated and unresolved question of how much microwave radiation a human being can safely be exposed to will probably forestall applications within the near future." (396) (Justesen, 1975)

The major problem with this part of Justesen's article is it combines Justesen's speculations about electromagnetic energy with the research results of Sharp and Grove. Here's what Sharp and Grove did:

(1) Sharp and Grove recorded the sounds of the numbers
(2) Played the sounds in the form of electromagnetic energy to themselves
(3) With training the two subjects, Sharp and Grove, were able to"able to hear, identify, and distinguish among the 9 words."

The assertion that "[t]he sounds heard were not unlike those emitted by persons with artificial larynxes" is JUSTESEN'S CLAIM!!! NOT SHARP AND GROVE. ALL THEY DISCOVERED IS THAT THEY CAN TRAIN THEMSELVES TO IDENTIFY THE NUMBERS ONE THROUGH NINE VIA ELECTROMAGNETIC ENERGY.

Furthermore, Justesen's speculations about electromagnetic energy's potentials are unfounded. He speculates that "[t]he capability of communicating directly with a human being by "receiverless radio" has obvious potentialities" when all that has been discovered is that TWO SUBJECTS CAN TRAIN THEMSELVES TO IDENTIFY THE NUMBERS ONE THROUGH NINE VIA ELECTROMAGNETIC ENERGY.

If you read the article Eleanor you would be able to see the difference between Sharp and Grove's findings and Justesen's description and speculation about what those findings. Here you commit yourself to that mistake by appealing to Justesen:

Squirrel1 wrote:And I spoke with Dr. Justesen by telephone and he confirmed to me that SPEECH WAS HEARD by Sharp when Sharp acted as a test subject.

To be clear: ALL THAT HAS BEEN DISCOVERED IS THAT TWO SUBJECTS CAN TRAIN THEMSELVES TO IDENTIFY THE NUMBERS ONE THROUGH NINE VIA ELECTROMAGNETIC ENERGY. Reasoning from this that gang stalkers are shooting you in the head with voices in the form of whole meaningful sentences of the English language is an enormous, irrational and unjustifiable leap of reason.

When 5-HT 2A Serotonin receptors are stimulated with Lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD) people experience visual and auditory hallucinations. When the same 5-HT 2A Serotonin receptors are inhibited by the Risperidone or Clozapine persons who are experiencing visual and auditory hallucinations cease to have these experiences. But what about the gang stalkers!?

So which is it Eleanor? Are your 5-HT 2A Serotonin receptors too active or is there a whole army of gang stalkers with voice to skull technology shooting you in the head with "buzzes, clicks and humms" which you might with training be able to tell the difference between?

Freedom from the nightmare your experiencing is the truth: it's up to you now Eleanor. I can't keep explaining this forever. We've been going over the same sources again and again and again. I've tried to help and the fact that your going to live with this delusion for the rest of your life makes me incredibly sad. Please take care of yourself.

*Edit* This post includes brow beating, sarcasm and meanness. I'm not going to edit any of it out but just acknowledge that it is present in this post and goes against much of what I intended which was to explain why voice to skull technology does not exist and that the gang stalking described by the V2S community is too implausible and unsupported to be taken as a serious hypothesis. My apologizes Eleanor.