The mental health profession, used to destroy undesirables?

oh_that_guy wrote:On not being able track those they want to target: Mandating health care, when it kicks into effect here, if you don't have health insurance you will pay a fine. Over and over again until you get it, because it's Mandated.

Mandates have nothing to do with tracking. It's passive. Yeah, ok, something may be flagged on a computer due to a mandate but you don't have people sitting around looking for you. It only enters the system if someone actively notes it.

--Why would they have spent, what was it, almost $800 billion, that they didn't have in the first place, without first having a means to know who has it and who doesn't? I'm not saying our federal govt. is completely competent, nor am I saying they are completely incompetent.

Who has what? I don't know what you are talking about.

--Say they won't track your status on a monthly basis, but only when you try and receive healthcare. If you weren't in the system, how would they backdate how much you owe for not having insurance since it's mandated? If they weren't worried about the exact sum you owe, just the fact that you have zero insurance would be enough to throw cuffs on you and throw you in jail, much like not paying/submitting state and fed tax forms and payments. The system alone is enough of a tracking method. People can avoid it, but they would have to avoid anything associated with it for the remainder of the time the law is in effect. Probably afterwards as well.

That's like tracking but it is passive tracking. Somebody has to flag it and somebody has to pull it up from the system. And this is a normal part of the system which would be happening anyway, it is not specifically targeted even if they target certain information gained from it.

--Even if it's not a chip that stores all your medical records, the fact that the law is in place enables the tracking. I'm not saying that anywhere you go you'll be required to show you're insured, because as it stands now, no one can ask you for your citizenship papers.

That goes for everyone. Even government officials. That's still a passive blanket system, not active tracking.

On society being a net with holes: What's that quote, history is doomed to repeat itself if one doesn't learn the mistakes and apply appropriate reform, whatever it exactly is, it's along those lines anyway. How appalled do you feel when you think about genocide in a country when it is brought into light? How/why would they do such a thing? People stand up, rally together, put an end to the inhumanity. America saw this after WWII. The fed govt took notice, they couldn't take the same route Hitler took. So they started on figuring out how else to accomplish this. The Cold War wasn't about Capitalism vs. Communism, it was about learning their secrets for controlling the people. Espionage was taken to a whole new level.

So, work on proving it and coming up with a plan to do something about it. The people caught in it are obviously not going to be much help if they are already under control. They aren't going to see it until it is right under their nose. History repeats itself because everyone makes hypothesis and few make solutions.

I kind of see where you're headed with people just turning away and let the cards fall where they fall. It makes sense. A man doesn't want to work, let him starve and freeze in the night. Also, I couldn't say what a professional really knows or doesn't know, how could I say anything? No, I can't. I can see what tools are available at this period in time though. Our world is a wicked world, filled with deceit and hate. Maybe I'm wrong, I cannot predict the future, and in fact I hope I'm mislead.

You could be on the right track, maybe. Have you heard of the term 'Zeitgeist'? The spirit of the times? I'm almost certain this is in play. It's mostly memetics and herd mentality at work. Zeitgeist can almost become its own entity, it can be emergent and spontaneously arising. This stuff doesn't have to be planned by the CIA. Maybe a couple things are but they are an exception - most of it happens because people react to each other like one large evolutionary mass. You could look for someone in charge but most of the time you won't actually find anyone, because there never was anyone since it is circular in nature without really a distinct origin or one single cause.

So really, all I am saying is, to change this you have to direct your energy in the appropriate places, effectively. The government isn't the sole problem. Maybe they aren't helping much either, maybe they happen to benefit from the way things are, but they are not the masterminds - even if you take them down it will happen again. Change has to be made elsewhere. In the people.

gwilly wrote:Who has what? I don't know what you are talking about.

I was referring to citizens who carried or didn't carry health coverage.

Tracking, in the instances I was using the health bill as an example, you're right, it would be passive, much like an arrest warrant is passive, if the police raid the criminal's house and turn up nothing, they just wait until they happen to stumble across him, or perhaps receive a tip from someone on their location.

I was also using the mandate to suggest how active tracking may be introduced to the public. And yes I say may, I hold no evidence for I have no resources to acquire such, and I realize this. It wouldn't start off active, but the examples I gave was an attempt to explain the initial implentation of the new law. For instance, the sun won't set one night and raise the next, and magically every single person will have a new set of beliefs. Even if a mass biological outbreak were to happen, entire lifestyles don't just shift, it takes time and events.

Active tracking on the entire population is far too dramatic a change to occur overnight, there's too many people like you mentioned. People who believe they've been implanted, on the other hand, is a far lesser number. While they receive the stamp of an undesirable, the new system is being tested, active tracking I refer to here.

Let me jump here - you mentioned zeitgeist, I haven't read too much into it, but I have spent a lot of time thinking of group settings. On a mass scale, a mandated law will affect the entire country's population, but if it's a gradual thing, people won't be opposed to hopping on board with the idea. After that, it's only another little step before jumping from passive to active tracking. Another little step, the same amount of people won't be opposed to just a little step. Just a little tweak in the passive system, require people to get a simple chip to make their job a little more efficient, whatever sales pitch they need to use. Maybe it's prepostrous to state my beliefs such as these here, and I mean no offense.

And again I thank you for trying to lead me in a better direction. It is all about effectiveness. There isn't any good in placing blame on one person, or a group. It doesn't hurt, it may help you live just one more day, maybe. But it really won't alter anything. I'm not sure why I even bother pursuing this #######4.

Change in the people. I do believe the one coming after me will be able to do that, to open eyes of the people. I can't say it really is solely our leaders fault that the deceit has blinded their people, the truth is all around, and by truth I don't mean erroneously turning to man for answers, when man is the same as you and me, the same level, what more truth do they know than you or me. When you turn to the world, you get worldly responses - zeitgeist - how is truth equivalent to popular belief I will never understand.

Well, as the Chinese proverb goes: "Three men make a tiger". It's unfortunate that if enough people believe something, it will be seen as truth. Even if it isn't.

And yeah, it could evolve into more active tracking. I feel the real way out of it is for people to realize themselves and their destiny. Every corrupt official was once an innocent child. Every killer, every robber, every drug pusher, they were all at some time just little babies who didn't know good or bad. There had to be something which taught them somewhere to be what they grew up to be.

Tyrants are not born. They are made. They are made by the people who come before them. And some times they are made by ourselves.