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25 GOOD REASONS WHY PSYCHIATRY MUST BE ABOLISHED

Open discussion about the Anti-Psychiatry Movement and related topics. This includes the opposition to forced treatment and hospitalization as well as the belief that Psychiatric Medication does more harm than good. Please note that these topics are controversial and therefore this forum may offend some people. This is not the belief of Psych Forums or Get Mental Help and this forum was posted to offer a safe place to discuss these beliefs.

The List

Postby Jimbo » Fri Apr 22, 2005 2:35 pm

That list about psychiatry doesn't even deserve to be responded to. But I will anyway. Obviously, whoever posted that list, had an extremely bad experience with a psychiatrist or two and has since had it out for them. Also, it appears as though the person who posted that has symptoms of schizophrenia. The overall mood of that posting is "these people are out to get us!", "They have evil intentions and must be stopped!". It might just be me but I feel like that type of attitude is reflective not of the truth of the matter, but rather the schizoid thought processes of whoever believes it. I don't mean that as an insult, I am just trying to bring to light the paranoia that seems to underlie a lot of the claims about psychiatrists. Obviously, the field is far from perfect but it is absolutely ludicrous to claim that all who practice pyschology are somehow evil and trying to harm people. There are a great many who have an honest desire to help people who are in mental dire straits. My therapist is very kind and helpful and even though he is against the use of medication, he has supported me all the way in my choice to start taking it because he wants to see me get better in whatever way possible.
Jimbo
 


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yeaaaah......

Postby Jimbo » Fri Apr 22, 2005 2:46 pm

Depression and mental illness have been around since the birth of human beings. There have always been those who were down and out of society and obviously clinically depressed. They didn't have multi-national corporations or MTV in the past, yet plenty of people were still depressed. Depression is also found in tribal societies in Africa where there are no tv's or radios or influences from the West. It seems as though there is some evidence that depression and its related illnesses have multiple causes, including biological or chemical, and it is not simply due to some "toxic culture" that we live in. If our culture promotes depression so much than why does only a small minority of people in the U.S. (the most toxic of all) suffer from depression?? All the books you read say there is an "epidemic" of depression in this country but it is simply not true when considering the big picture. People who are depressed are an exception to the rule, not the rule. Agreed, many in this country are not happy all of the time, but they certainly do not suffer from the crippling effects of clinical depression. We depressed would like to think that everyone else feels more or less like we do but that is simply not the truth. Most people have a normal range of emotions and can generally get through life with some ups and downs. We, on the other hand, have a significant illness that needs to be treated either with psychotherapy or medication. I PROMISE you that only a small minority of those currently depressed would recover if we changed our culture completely and all of a sudden became a completely benevolent society. We need to change our society, but that is a SEPARATE issue. Mental illness needs appropriate attention and cannot be resolved simply by changing external institutions.
Jimbo
 

Postby Guest » Sat Apr 23, 2005 12:36 am

Jimbo,

It's a gutless and weak act to insult people with your crap over the internet you #^%*@#! troll.

So as far as your concerned anyone who disagrees is paranoid and schizoid hey? Ha Ha Ha!

I could absolutely flood this forum with facts that contradict your views but I wont. Here's just a glimpse into the real world Jimbo.

The coming May 2 is an International day of Remembrance and Resistance. This is the day the world remembers the hundreds of thousands of Patients murdered by their psychiatrists in the Second World War. The days is also to remember the current and past victims of coercive psychiatry.
http://www.freedom-of-thought.de/may2/

May 2 is also the the anniversary of the Foucault Tribunal. This is where psychiatry was put on trial, I have attached the verdict below.

The Verdict of the Foucault Tribunal
"We conclude that, being unwilling to renounce the use of force, violence and coercion, psychiatry is guilty of crimes against humanity: the deliberate destruction of dignity, liberty and life. Most of all through the legal category of "mental patient" which permits a total deprivation of human and civil rights and the laws of natural justice. Furthermore, psychiatry cannot pretend to the art of healing, having violated the Hippocratic Oath through a conscious use of harmful drugs, which caused in particular the world wide epidemic of tardive dyskinesia, as well as other interventions which we recognize as tortures: involuntary confinement, forced drugging, four point restraints, electroshock, all forms of psychosurgery and outpatient commitment. These practices and ideology allowed the psychiatrists during the Nazi era to go to the extreme of systematic mass murder of inmates under the pretext of "treatment". Psychiatry not only refuses to renounce the force it has historically obtained from the state, it even takes on the role of a highly paid and respected agent of social control and international police force over behavior and the repression of political and social dissent. We find psychiatry guilty of the combination of force and unaccountability, a classic definition of totalitarian systems. We demand the abolition of the "mental patients" laws as a first step toward making psychiatry accountable to society. To this end, compensation will have to be made for the harms it has done. Public funds must also be made available for humane and dignified alternatives to Psychiatry."

Reasons for the Verdict

"The defense speaks of the therapeutic necessity for psychiatric coercion and, if necessary, the use of physical force. They admit though, that in "good psychiatric institutions" as little coercion as possible is used. Coercion is apparently not therapeutic, rather it is dependent on the type of psychiatry practiced. We condemn all forms of psychiatric coercion as a violation of human rights. The laws for the mentally ill prescribe psychiatric coercion in the case of danger to oneself or others. In practice this is widely transgressed. The matter is only one of endangerment; no crime has been committed. This means that preventive detention is being practiced. The defense describes someone as being mentally ill because his ability to help himself is reduced. They believe that he should be relieved of certain societal demands because of impairments in his ability to experience and behave as expected by society. We are of the opinion that the accepted idea of illness is inadequate. In this case an institution such as a psychiatric hospital cannot offer any assistance. We are of the opinion that treatment by doctors should only be applied on a voluntary basis. It is especially dangerous that many judges are biased and that they agree with the expert opinions of the psychiatrists. Psychiatric survivors have a right to demand financial compensation for any pain and suffering they experienced."

Berlin, 2nd of May 1998

http://www.foucault.de/

A world wide movement started 30 years ago called the "survivor movement". Our movement is gaining strength everyday. We are going to get psychiatry held accountable for it's actions.

Ya see Jimbo, not everyone thinks like you, calling people who don't paranoid schizophrenics over the internet speaks volumes about your personality.
Guest
 

Postby Guest » Sat Apr 23, 2005 4:41 am

"Part 6/Psychiatric Disorders
"ENDOGENOUS DEPRESSION AND MANIC-DEPRESSIVE DISEASE
"Etiology
...
"Biochemical Theories The biogenic monoamines (norepinephrine, serotonin, and dopamine) are the key elements in these theories. ... However, the aforementioned CSF [cerebro-spinal fluid] findings have not been consistent; in some patients with depressive illness, the CSF concentrations of bioamine metabolites are entirely normal. Most of the neurochemical theories of depression have been the result of reasoning backwards from the known effects antidepressants on various neurotransmitters. ...serotonin and its pathways are currently most strongly implicated in the genesis of depression; however, the reader should be reminded that only a decade ago it was widely held that depletion of norepinephrine fulfilled this role. ...
"[T]he biogenic amine hypothesis...leaves several fundamental questions unanswered. ... Why are the therapeutic results so inconsistent with the use of tricyclic antidepressants, the MAO inhibitors, and the serotonin reuptake inhibitors, all of which should favorably influence the balance of biogenic amines at the proper receptor sites? And why are the clinical effects of these drugs delayed for weeks while the biochemical reactions are almost immediate? ... At the present time, it must be conceded that there is no reliable biologic test for depression. ...
Psychosocial theories ... Among patients with primary depressive disorders, life events of a stressful nature were found to have occurred more frequently in the months preceding the onset of depression than in matched control groups. In the study of Thomson and Hendrie, this was equally true of patients with a positive family history of depression and those without such a history. Nor did patients with endogenous depression differ in this respect from those with reactive depression." (In other words, even people with supposedly endogenous depression had good reason, in terms of life-experience, to feel despondent or "depressed.")
Maurice Victor, M.D., Professor of Medicine and Neurology, Dartmouth Medical School; and Allan H. Ropper, M.D., Professor and Chairman of Neurology, Tufts University School of Medicine, Adams and Victor's Principles of Neurology - Seventh Edition, McGraw-Hill Medical Publishing Division, New York, 2001, pp. 1616-1618.
Guest
 

Flaming is not allowed.

Postby sweetngentle » Sat Apr 23, 2005 1:27 pm

Dear Guest,

In these forums name calling, or flaming is not allowed.

Your statement:
Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 7:36 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jimbo,

It's a gutless and weak act to insult people with your crap over the internet you #^%*@#! troll


Will not be tolerated any longer. If you continue to resort name calling your post will be removed. If it continues after that you will be banned from this site.

Kathy
Blessed are those
who can give without
remembering, and take
without forgetting.
sweetngentle
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Postby Guest » Sat Apr 23, 2005 11:12 pm

Kathy,

I don't need to continue, I just wish to convey my disgust with Jimbo's attempts to stereotype people with SZ. Not all people diagnosed SZ are paranoid or believe people are out to get them.

I'm sure Jimbo would not like me stating all people with depression are weak. Get my point?
Guest
 

Postby Guest » Sat Apr 23, 2005 11:40 pm

Also Kathy,

When does seanetal return and this anti psych forum going to be set up?
Guest
 

Postby sweetngentle » Sun Apr 24, 2005 1:22 am

Dear Guest,

In your post:
I don't need to continue, I just wish to convey my disgust with Jimbo's attempts to stereotype people with SZ. Not all people diagnosed SZ are paranoid or believe people are out to get them.


Point well taken by me :) I suffer from severe depression and actually I sometimes look at myself as weak....really I do!

About Sean...her should be returning any day. Might I suggest that you start a topic regarding adding the new forum? I know he is looking for people to be moderators there. I myself think it a terrific idea. It will bring balance to this entire site.

Kathy
Blessed are those
who can give without
remembering, and take
without forgetting.
sweetngentle
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Postby hav0k » Sun Apr 24, 2005 2:20 am

annihilate psychiatry!!!!!!!!!!! :twisted:
ph03n1x 1n tra1n1ng
hav0k
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hmm

Postby jimbo » Sun Apr 24, 2005 7:38 am

I love how people pick out one or two sentences out of a whole page of writing and blow it completely out of proportion. Everyone seems to want to make my comment into an indictment of me as a person. All I was saying was that the list seemed to be very conspiratorial and unfounded. My point was not directed at people with schizophrenia and I even wrote in the piece that I did not mean anything as an insult. It is definitely a good thing to be sensitive to other people but it can be taken too far at times. If you totally flip out at one person's comment that wasn't even inflammatory then how will you deal with people outside of this forum who don't understand mental illness at all? I respect other people's conditions and lord knows I have my own but we should attempt to not take such great offense to anythign anyone says that can remotely be interpreted as an insult. Not all of us are perfect and can always sound nice and politically correct. Sometimes you have to accept that people might tread on your toes a bit without doing it on purpose. There is no need to bite their head off and threaten to ban them from the forum. But then again I suppose we are all pretty thin-skinned around here...
If you lose one leg, hop. If you lose both legs, crawl.
jimbo
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