Navy Yard shooting: Aaron Alexis, Psych meds N SSRIs ?

Doctors are amongst the least liked profession because most people feel like doctors only come into there lives when they are sick. Psychiatrist are the least respected of doctors because most people feel like they are not needed and are not fact based. I don't know where the idea that most people are okay with psychiatry comes from. We don't know if this guy really had mental health issues or not. Doctors are known for misdiagnosing and over diagnosing things. What we do know is people get discriminated against once they are labelled with mental health problems.

I just saw this story about Aaron Alexi navy yard shooting on the news and they were blaming video games again !

Not one single word about all these shooters taking mind altering drugs, nothing !

Now they are saying that he never had a professional mental health diagnosis. Just shows how they will try to claim any and everyone has a mental health issue everytime something happens. America is really pushing this mental health agenda

Notice a trend with these mass shootings. Everybody who does them has had some psychiatric issues prior. I'm sure it's true, but the thing seems to be that murder sprees are the result of mental imbalance, not anything to do with the general apathy of our culture and society. Other countries have violent video games same as our's but don't have these kinds of problems. Partly because of differences in gun laws, but moreso because of differences in overall culture. Our's is a very selfish and consumer culture. We want whatever we want, and feel entitled to it. When done to excess this results in criminality since if someone else has something we want, we feel entitled to take it. We then reward such behaviours with fame and notoriety. We all remember the perpetrators of murder sprees, but can we name two or three of the victims? In our youtube society, some feel fame is the most desired thing. Regardless of why you get it.

The problem then may be an ass-backwards society valueing the polar opposite things it shoudl be. And a reinforcing media and pop culture that rewards negative behaviours consciously or not. Throw in psychiatric illness and the stage is set for bad things to happen. For properly functioning minds we know what not to do, even in the face of temptation and positive reinforcement to do them. But a wrong-thinking mind will do them because everything around them is encouraging them to do so.

HesDeltanCaptain wrote:Notice a trend with these mass shootings. Everybody who does them has had some psychiatric issues prior. I'm sure it's true, but the thing seems to be that murder sprees are the result of mental imbalance, not anything to do with the general apathy of our culture and society. Other countries have violent video games same as our's but don't have these kinds of problems. Partly because of differences in gun laws, but moreso because of differences in overall culture. Our's is a very selfish and consumer culture. We want whatever we want, and feel entitled to it. When done to excess this results in criminality since if someone else has something we want, we feel entitled to take it. We then reward such behaviours with fame and notoriety. We all remember the perpetrators of murder sprees, but can we name two or three of the victims? In our youtube society, some feel fame is the most desired thing. Regardless of why you get it.

The problem then may be an ass-backwards society valueing the polar opposite things it shoudl be. And a reinforcing media and pop culture that rewards negative behaviours consciously or not. Throw in psychiatric illness and the stage is set for bad things to happen. For properly functioning minds we know what not to do, even in the face of temptation and positive reinforcement to do them. But a wrong-thinking mind will do them because everything around them is encouraging them to do so.

Excellent points. Violence is deeply embedded in our culture. Blaming it on "mental illness" and then prescribing more of this poison as a paradoxical remedy for the poison itself is utterly self-defeating, which is what we do when we conscript sacrificial scapegoats from amongst the "mentally ill" as a means of eradicating violence, reconciling all the warring factions in society at the expense of a scapegoat whose sacrifice offers hope of the restoration of harmony (and does to a large degree because it functions as a bonding mechanism for those united in the persecution of the poor sod conscripted into this role) yet detracts from the cultural matrix in which such violence has been formed. It is just scapegoating, transferring all the blame onto a group of individuals who lack power and powerful advocates, and then sacrificing them, albeit the process is mystified by the medical model and the language of therapy, which renders the violence mandated by society and carried out by its internal protectors more palatable. This was one of the points of sacrifice in primitive societies, and we have inherited their legacy, yet people in general are so astonishingly conceited, they think they know everything and that they are so enlightened that their insight into themselves and the institutions and customs that structure their society is limitless, and because they don't understand the scapegoating mechanism (mechanism being the operative word here, because scapegoating is always an unconscious, unthinking process, buried under a mountain of mythological justifications), it issues logically from this premise that it can't be true.

As for the comment about the lack of people on here, in comparison to the amount of people on other forums championing psychiatric drugs, it is a non sequitur to say that that means there are far more people who find the drugs helpful. This site isn't a barometer of patient opinion about psychiatric drugs. There are tons of people who testify to the suffering these drugs can cause on the internet, it's just that not many people come to this forum, for various reasons.

Anyway, this is a matter of inconsequence, because regardless of what people might think, all beliefs do not occupy a position of equality in relation to each other regarding the degree of truth they contain. People, in their understanding of the world, imitate others (hence why independent thought is such a dubious concept). Specifically, they usually imitate entities more powerful than themselves, such as experts, the herd (see the bandwagon effect), people considered desirable in the context of their culture because of the adulatory gazes that converge on them (such as celebrities and sports stars, even though such people offer little in the way of true understanding of almost anything), and the people who exercise authority over them in relations hierarchically arranged, such as between parent and child, master and slave (and I don't just mean in its literal sense, but am referring to all relations that crystallize around the master-slave dialectic), and psychiatrist and patient (which, of course, overlaps in its nature with the preceding relationship).

Cledwyn Bulbs wrote:As for the comment about the lack of people on here, in comparison to the amount of people on other forums championing psychiatric drugs, it is a non sequitur to say that that means there are far more people who find the drugs helpful. This site isn't a barometer of patient opinion about psychiatric drugs. There are tons of people who testify to the suffering these drugs can cause on the internet, it's just that not many people come to this forum, for various reasons.

I agree with this

Anyway, this is a matter of inconsequence, because regardless of what people might think, all beliefs do not occupy a position of equality in relation to each other regarding the degree of truth they contain. People, in their understanding of the world, imitate others (hence why independent thought is such a dubious concept). Specifically, they usually imitate entities more powerful than themselves, such as experts, the herd (see the bandwagon effect), people considered desirable in the context of their culture because of the adulatory gazes that converge on them (such as celebrities and sports stars, even though such people offer little in the way of true understanding of almost anything), and the people who exercise authority over them in relations hierarchically arranged, such as between parent and child, master and slave (and I don't just mean in its literal sense, but am referring to all relations that crystallize around the master-slave dialectic), and psychiatrist and patient (which, of course, overlaps in its nature with the preceding relationship).

Well put, it does make a lot of sense when one thinks about it. I think it boils down to what people always have been taught, do no question authority and do as authority says. It makes easy to manage children but poor adults at self sustainability. I think that in order for any point to get across most people have to present themselves as an authority figure even if they are not. When one does not, their own opinion and true facts are often disregarded. Hence many people just to feel heard without thinking start to imitate authority. And of course, celebrities are not always the best role models.


I dont know if anyone has posted this yet but here goes:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/ ... story.html


The thing is yes, antidepressants can help some, but I know both from experience and my own research SSRIs and SNRIs come with great risk in that some have very seroius reactions to them. I truly believe SSRIs and the like should be prescribed and given ina controlled environment under the care of a doctor. Sounds stupid to most psychs, but look at the news stories and I think you can see where my views come from:

http://ssristories.com/index.php

There are so many factors in this that you would have to draw a huge huge ecosystemic map on it--from the sociological consequences of the timeline from the Great Depression-WWII and the Babyboomers, to the drug use and the "parental experts" of the 1960's, to the Media's role in propoganda and the "unthinking" skills in schools, and the culture of convienence which gives way [b]to emotional shallowness and the knowledge that something is wrong but isn't fixable--a lack of insight to solve the problems or to deal with life .


The Great Depression was a time of heavy deficit with material goods and with food. Many men from that era are very stolid and quiet. People came out of that and a few then years later are the world wars. Men and women are brave and fight-in various ways. . The shell shocked PTSD men are strong and stoic, but dysfunctional and the women are strong but realize that they too are repressed and oppressed. Then, the WWII generation wanted to pamper the next generation because of all that they went through. But then, there is prosperity and folks get spoiled. Parents want to give their children what they didn't have.


With new technology and convienence, specialization shows up. (No, I am not a luddite!) Then the rise of the "experts" comes and the more positive qualities of the traditional family structure get messed upo with the rise of the "specialist" and people forget to think for themselves like they were able to in the Depression and the War. During the Depression and World Wars, you had to think on your feet and you had to be very very strong in ego strength. Also, convienence makes people feel more entitled.

The children of the 1960's are intelligent but are bombarded with drugs. This isn't to say that some aspects of the 1960's weren't good like civil rights, but then came LSD and that wasn't good. So, we recovered from that, and then the government made us go into Vietnam and blame the veterans, which created dualism and confusion. We had degentrification with up and down economies and companies outsourcing and moving out from cities happen---- gangsterism went up and there was more alienation of the teen from the parent.

At th end of the Cold War, the security companies needed to make a profit so survelliance was borne of greed and that made things worse. So everyone became suspicious of one another. Lack of personal self control from weak parenting mixed in with this surveillance created more paranoia. Cookie cutter education, came into play and pop psychology and the forgetting of hard core reasoning like you have to do knowing about /debating about philosophy or working math/ problems by hand and in your mind. "Diagnostic" and all that lablelling came up and then the psychiatric community somehow latched on andevolved into this horrid social control of kids in school with drugs. Recess got cut because we thought that this NCLBA would "help us." The cutting of recess cut out kids mental health and the adhd diagnoisis became more prevelant because kids need play, excersise and fresh air.

Add to all of this imbalance the way that males are treated. "Buck up and take it" and how many boys are called ADHD (and I'm hypocrite for saying that, but..........) Then, as teenagers, (boys) are criminalized for small things------ oops-having a cigarette and bringing it to school, so that ruins their self image and creates self fulfilling prophecy and they sit in their rooms and play these semi violent video games. They are isolated and depressed. I guess that is where the "SSRI's" come in. The SSRI's "boost" sensations and can create a high feeling where the false might seem real. This in tandem with the movies they see gives them a feeling of non reality.

Cissex identifying males, I have observed, tend to be mischevious and wear their heart on their sleeve when they are young but tend to be objective and stoic later in life. Normally, the process of this heart on the sleeve transitioning to the cissex identifying male personality pattern to the more stoic and objective personality (formed by about age 30 or so) goes normally but it is disrupted when the young male is given antipsychotics. In general, antipsychotics are supposed to supress any "dysfunctional behavior", but it SHUTS DOWN most people's reasoning; it shuts down motor control and it makes a lot of people aggressive because you are tired, and sick and depressed--the antipsychotics create nutrient deficiencies; skin problems and problems with proteins in the blood and it makes people sick and ornery. How in God's name is anyone supposed to reason with such a horrific zomifying drug?



For both genders, I see both young ladies and men discriminated against. Whilst they are not disciplined as in true, loving (non spanking) discipline is not given, a general disrespect as to the ideas and issues of the teen to young adults (18-25) are not addressed. They have real concerns and real feelings and they are blocked out by a few (not all) toxic, jealous adults who treat them poorly. I have seen this with my daughter and with other teenagers. And yet, teens who have supportive family members, church members and teachers often have healthy personalities.

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Americans are "policed" behaviorally. We are supposed to respond to cookie cutter school; our teen concerns and young adult issues are ignored. Then, we are supposed to be "okay" with surveillance, or the waste of capitalism or by ecological disasters, or people dying in Afghanistan and Iraq/Iran and Africa and we are supposed to be "okay" with all of these natural disasters and all of this. We are supposed to go "ho de dum dum dum" about our little lives without freaking out over all of this STUFF. That we have an anomie, a feeling that we know we decimated the Native American or we know that we destroy people's lives for oil, or that we know that we are not crusaders but are confronted by being "for" all of this destruction. All respect and love for the troops, I feel angry at the government, not them.


In general, here is less community. It seems like less people go to the parks anymore; folks stay in and play video games losing touch with reality. People seem less able to love one another anymore, creating lack of (appropriate) affection. Then, we get infotainment instead of news--conflicting views and propoganda and the "ideal" woman and "ideal" man and all this gobbldy-gook from the television? What are young people and alienated people to do? All this confusion and instablity would make any regular person get aggrressive if they don't have a voice or rights. It is a wonder that all of us in the US aren't acting out.
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Disclaimer: None of this is prejudicial against anyone transgender, LGBT or against feminism or anything of that nature, but just stating that Western society has a lot to wake up from. Its like we are doing things backwards and no matter what, none of us are allowed to be ourselves.

HesDeltanCaptain wrote:Notice a trend with these mass shootings. Everybody who does them has had some psychiatric issues prior. I'm sure it's true, but the thing seems to be that murder sprees are the result of mental imbalance, not anything to do with the general apathy of our culture and society. Other countries have violent video games same as our's but don't have these kinds of problems. Partly because of differences in gun laws, but moreso because of differences in overall culture. Our's is a very selfish and consumer culture. We want whatever we want, and feel entitled to it. When done to excess this results in criminality since if someone else has something we want, we feel entitled to take it. We then reward such behaviours with fame and notoriety. We all remember the perpetrators of murder sprees, but can we name two or three of the victims? In our youtube society, some feel fame is the most desired thing. Regardless of why you get it.

The problem then may be an ass-backwards society valueing the polar opposite things it shoudl be. And a reinforcing media and pop culture that rewards negative behaviours consciously or not. Throw in psychiatric illness and the stage is set for bad things to happen. For properly functioning minds we know what not to do, even in the face of temptation and positive reinforcement to do them. But a wrong-thinking mind will do them because everything around them is encouraging them to do so.

This is simply not fact. Not everyone of these mass shooters has a valid psych history. Doctors are known for misdiagnosing and overdiagnosing. It is easy for people to try and categorize other people and things by saying there all crazy. The reality is almost anyone is capable of anything. So, for someone really looking to solve problems the thing to do is say maybe we need to get rid of guns period, instead of saying guns are only bad when in the hands of people with psych problems because the ladder is not a true statement. Police commit crimes with guns, gang members commit crimes with guns, etc.

In my opinion, the problem wasn't if they had a 'psych history', that had nothing to do with it, the problem was , that viewing the list of names of the mass shooters, they had mainly ALL been TAKING or WITHDRAWING from anti depressants (mainly), and some anti psychotics.

The problem is, are these drugs causing homicidality?