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COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby Oblivion » Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:21 pm

Cholls wrote:
A lot of scientists have said a lot of things, for example, that the fat content of food, and not high fructose corn syrup, was responsible for obesity. Many of the things scientists say are subsequently debunked.


It was the sugar industry that manipulated that claim. Look it up. Nutritionists are the foot soldiers of capitalism. For example, it has been shown that cinnamon can be effective as drugs in managing blood sugar for some people, but the cinnamon industry doesn't have a fraction of the dollars that big pharma has. Money trumps truth. It always will.

Could this all have been orchestrated by leftists in order to collapse the economy beyond repair?

solemnlysworn wrote:The whole 'you may be asymptomatic and spreading the disease, putting others at danger' argument is more interesting. Most people who still go out are tending to use 'we're young and probably aren't going to die because of it' and 'everybody is going to get it anyway' as rebuttals which I think is less easily justified since, rather than being about survival, they have the capacity to put other vulnerable people at risk by refusing to let go of their current lifestyles.


On Tuesday the media was awash with stories about how millennials weren't taking this thing seriously and practicing social distancing. Funny how they all wait until there's a pandemic to put down their sticky little iPhones and go spring breaking. Then, yesterday, all I see are stories about how the young are becoming increasingly vulnerable to the virus and some are dying.

If your luscious paranoia has any merit, Cholls, what role do you think the media is playing in all this?
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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby Cholls » Fri Mar 20, 2020 4:42 am

Oblivion wrote:Could this all have been orchestrated by leftists in order to collapse the economy beyond repair?

The "left" and the "right" ultimately both work for the same sponsors, people and institutions so wealthy that failure to work for those sponsors would render them as politically viable as the Libertarian Party.

Oblivion wrote:what role do you think the media is playing in all this?

The same role they always play, catering to the whims of the central banks and the major shareholders of the handful of media conglomerates that control Hollywood, publishing, social media and streaming sites, amusement parks, entertainment franchises such as sports and gambling, etc.



People of all ages (except, at least to date, Henry Kissinger) die every day of a variety of things.

The sugar example may have been poorly chosen, but I'm sure I could find "scientific" studies from back then that supported the "deadliness" of dietary fat, such as butter and coconut oil, while ignoring the evils of sugar, which I have proven to myself.

I'm too lazy to look these up right now, but I've read of enough cases in which medication for a variety of conditions was hastened through the FDA approval process, only to be recalled after a significant number of fatality-related lawsuits. After all, at one time, DDT and thalidomide got thumbs-up, just like glyphosates. The Tuskegee Study of Untreated Syphilis in the Negro Male was as real as was Project MKUltra.

With enough money, a given entitiy will find no shortage of science Ph.Ds. willing to say whatever they're paid to say. Academia and research are infernally competitive for funding, to the degree that one doesn't have to search deeply or for long to find instances in which scientific integrity was the first thing sacrificed.



The authorities cannot be trusted. We're on our own. What I posted may simply be my "luscious paranoia" at work. However, the technology I mentioned exists, and I can't name a major instance in history when such potentially powerful tools, once created, were not used.



My mother caught and survived the Hong Kong flu:
( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_flu_pandemic ).

I survived what I now realize was near-fatal food poisoning eating my usual shrimp dish from a New Haven Chinese restaurant, survived a suicide attempt and a broken back, survived cancer.

My late grandfather lived to 92 on absolutely no medication, with an incredibly sharp mind, despite a lifetime smoking Camel straights; working for decades without sunscreen on the open ocean in the equatorial sun wearing a tank top as a shirt--despite not being one, he was as a dark as any African American; with exposed asbestos under his kitchen sink; eating sunnyside-up eggs with butter nearly every day, bloody rare steaks often, and drinking scotch.

He openly defied every FDA recommendation, ate what he wanted, lived the way he wanted, and had but one remedy for everything from clinical depression to eczema, "Swim in the ocean.".

I come from a long line of real men and women who did not jump when told to. I will not kowtow to any authority. If it's my time to get sick and/or die, I'm fine with that. Eternal life would not be my idea of a good time, and I'm not about to modify my behavior just because some turd in a lab coat who couldn't stand eye-to-eye with my grandfather tells me to.



However, anyone even tempted to call me selfish, irresponsible, or amoral should also refrain from criticizing China's Social Credit System, aiming as it does for exactly the same thing: neighbors policing each other for the purpose of centralized social control.
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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby Cholls » Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:00 am

Regarding the Hong Kong flu ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_flu_pandemic ), neither my grandmother nor my grandfather got it (I can't recall them ever having been ill), but my mother did, and of course she didn't go to the doctor because my family doesn't go to the doctor for stuff unless it's cancer or a broken back. If COVID-19 behaves like the Hong Kong flu, we can't run away. It'll find us.

We'll not get it, get it and live, or get it and die. It was something that swept the population and naturally died out.

Might all flus behave like that? Inescapable, like Poe's Red Death?

If so, I wonder whether the best thing regarding pandemics might not be to simply get them over with, with people acquiring immunity?

At any rate, we're being studied. Bet on that.
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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby CuteLoneCat » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:53 pm

Cholls wrote: The two COVID-19-related deaths in Italy occurred with people in their 80s.


2? Yeah on 22 February...
Now it's 4032 deaths total and 627 in the last 24h.
The trouble is hospitals can't take so many patients at once. So people die because they couldn't get the care they needed, with that care they might have survived.
In Belgium hospitals have gotten guidelines to choose who to admit and who to refuse when it might or will be no longer possible to admit everyone in need of care.
It's certainly possible that the virus is man-made but I don't care much. I care about getting what I need in case that in 2 weeks from now I get heavily wounded in a car crash and my survival chance or quality of life is deemed too low to help me because others are in a better state than me.

There are certainly younger people also ending up in hospital but the difference is they usually recover, so you don't hear about them in the news. It is possible though they made it much worse themselves by taking the wrong medication (ibuprofen).
The patient 1 in Italy was in the hospital for over a month and he's only 38.
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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby Manners73 » Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:46 pm

Tinned peaches on toast, grilled with honey is supposed to be quite a beguiling treat.

Or so I've heard.
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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby Cholls » Tue Mar 24, 2020 9:45 am

People get sick and die from a lot of things. About a million people died from the Hong Kong flu. This is cold and flu season. When people panic, they tend not to follow the money.



"Coronaviruses are a family of viruses that range from the common cold to MERS, Middle East Respiratory Syndrome and SARS."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44wJgNRy24I&feature=youtu.be



Did a search for:

coronavirus follow the money

Because some senators and biotech firms are making a killing off of this. This is cold and flu season, and the media got mos' everybody who's coughing freaking out dat dey gon' die. Heading to the hospital. Overburdening the hospital. Germs are the atheists' bogeyman.

"States (surrender states' rights and) become federalized once they (declare a state of emergency and) receive (massive amounts of) federal funding.", blurring the distinction between the police and the military, among other things.

Johnson & Johnson participated in a U.N. coronavirus event simulation which took place just weeks before the actual coronavirus outbreak.

The CDC/Big Pharma mafia punishing Trump for having cut CDC funding. No wonder no presidents will touch the corrupt, cash-engorged Pentagon. Who knows how many wars they'd start. "Follow the money.". Works every time.

This is the first thing that has made sense to me:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dCvYC-KMNg

and:

https://www.activistpost.com/
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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby Ringil » Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:42 pm

Let me share a European view. (Sorry to spoiler the interesting conspiracy theories with boring science).

Here in Europe we have some countries that did ran out of hospital capacity. There are people arriving at the hospital, cannot get proper treatment and die - maybe sitting in a chair while they would need oxygen or a respiratory treatment. Doctors actually do disconnect 80 year old people from the respiratory device to give it to a 50 year old person, the 80 year old persons die then. (Triage). The army is searching dead people and they find a lot in the streets.

Other European countries still have sufficient capacities, there far less people die. Statistics say the difference is 10% die in the countries who are short in hospital capacity and 1% in countries with sufficient capacity (however, this statistics has a bias because some countries test less than others).

Scientists (well known ones, by a state order) here simulated a free outbreak and came to the result that roughly 50% (forgot the number) of the population would become sick, mainly in June/July, and then the outbreak would stop because the majority would be immune. However, the scientist estimated hundrets of thoudands of deaths by this approach (in a 80 mil. people county).

So in Europe the strategy is, to slow down the outbreak to an extend that the health system can cope with (more or less). Drawback: The countermeasures would have to last until 2021. The slower, the longer ... Then 70% of the population would have had the sickness, be immune (or dead), and then the immunity of the population would be sufficient, and the sickness stops on its own.

I hope that a vaxine or a medical treatment will appear soon, because the economy cannot wait until 2021.

I see three options:
a) Don't slow down. Population is immune in harvest. On a worldwide scale millions will die.
b) Slow down. Far! less people will die (remember 10% vs 1% above). But it lasts a looong time.
c) Slow down until vaxine/medication has been released. Then spread it and release the counter measures.

(Or in theory d) vastly extend the clinical capacities and then let the outbreak run freely. But that's not realistic. Machines and new staff need time to be prepared.)

I like c) most and wonder that there are billions and billions available for economic help, but I don't hear from billions and billions for vaxine/medication research ? Incl. money to speed up the regulation authorities.

My grand-grand-father died by the spanish flue by the way in 1918. Such events aren't so special maybe ...
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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby Cholls » Thu Mar 26, 2020 6:55 am

Ringil wrote:Let me share a European view. (Sorry to spoiler the interesting conspiracy theories with boring science).

How charming, but could you maybe ease up on the humility just a bit? (although I definitely appreciate your showing your true colors!)

Ringil wrote:The army is searching dead people and they find a lot in the streets.

Do you actually know anyone who has it or who is related to someone who has died specifically from COVID-19?

Ringil wrote:My grand-grand-father died by the spanish flue by the way in 1918. Such events aren't so special maybe ...

Not "maybe". We're all gonna get sick at some point, and we're all gonna die.

Hey, my great-aunt's parents survived a tsunami by clinging to palm trees.

Events such as this happen. The illusion that technology will allow us to exempt ourselves from such experiences gives us a false sense of security, which creates opportunities for some to make HUGE amounts of money and make inroads in our personal freedom.
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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby Cholls » Thu Mar 26, 2020 7:37 am

Ringil wrote:The army is searching dead people and they find a lot in the streets.

If everyone's supposed to stay inside, how are these dead people getting outside? Serious question.
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Re: COVID-19: a Global study of Mass and Individual Panic

Postby Cholls » Thu Mar 26, 2020 7:54 am

Hey, but it's only 'murica. Similar efforts can't possibly occur elsewhere.

https://i.imgur.com/es4bwHY.png
https://i.imgur.com/KmC2k0q.png
https://i.imgur.com/GEafpiL.png
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