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The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

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The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby Manners73 » Sun May 24, 2020 3:53 pm

This is something I've been stewing over of late.

I don't think it's something that's exclusive only to personality disorders but I've found that within the lists of characteristics there are a lot of contradictions.

It's like we want something and at the same time we don't.

I wanna be adored then when people like me I push them away.

I wanna be special but I'm the first to stand up and tell people that I'm anything but special.

Do you get what I mean?
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Re: The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby Manners73 » Sun May 24, 2020 5:32 pm

I'll put that more clearly now I've thought about it.

Here goes; I believe that I'm superior to people, that I have a higher purpose. And I believe that I'm entitled to more than anyone else but at the exact same time I believe that I am the scum of the earth.

This is my paradox.

I'm going to discuss this with my lady therapist on Tuesday, even though she has already told me that she is out of her depth.

I think it's a kindness and she might learn to swim in deeper waters.
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Re: The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby Akuma » Mon May 25, 2020 5:08 am

Manners73 wrote:This is something I've been stewing over of late.

I don't think it's something that's exclusive only to personality disorders but I've found that within the lists of characteristics there are a lot of contradictions.
It's like we want something and at the same time we don't.
I wanna be adored then when people like me I push them away.
I wanna be special but I'm the first to stand up and tell people that I'm anything but special.

Do you get what I mean?


I think this is a few different things being conflated, things that might look the same but in reality are not. But on the very basic level I would say that - maybe in a comparable development to your insight in regards to your relationships mentioned in the post about love - there at least seems to be a growing awareness of these opposing states and of inner ambivalence developing in you lately.
dx: dissociative disorder + npd
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Re: The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby justonemoreperson » Mon May 25, 2020 5:58 am

I think it's all about trust and confidence.

Woody Allen said, "Why would I join a club that would have someone like me as a member?"

If you have low confidence in yourself then you'll have a low impression of people who gravitate towards you; you'll be suspicious of their motives.

Admiration in itself is pointless. Admiration that comes from you achieving something is recognition of an achievement, so admiration cannot be a goal that will give you any satisfaction, because the goal should be achieving something, not the admiration, as this will come as a welcome side-effect.

People like Elon Musk and Richard Branson etc, they don't have "getting rich" as a goal. They have a desire to create something valuable, and the by-product of that is that they become rich. There's drive and passion behind what they do. Without them, the transient states of being admired become empty and fleeting.

You want to be adored and like the feeling? Do something to be adored for.
You want to be special? Do something special.

Your therapist sounds like a flake.
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Re: The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby Esmoke » Mon May 25, 2020 6:43 am

My general impression of this post as a whole is that of a very complicated set of circumstances. There is likely a lot going on beneath the surface to motivate these things. I find it more helpful to try and tackle small problems that are bothering you rather than trying to take on an entire condition at once. The psychology behind these symptoms will be revealed through the psychotherapy process. It takes time for this to happen, most good therapists look beyond symptoms towards the ideology or motivators behind them in order to understand them properly.
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Re: The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby Wally58 » Mon May 25, 2020 10:35 am

When I first began the 12 steps and listening to how other people got themselves better, I was told to try not to judge or compare myself to what other people were saying, what they had done or who they were. That could get my mindset into thinking that 'I was not like that' or 'I would never do that'.

Instead, I was told to try and relate to them as they told their life story. I could choose snippets I could use to improve myself and discard the rest.
Dropping my defenses and baring my soul, reaching out and connecting to another soul who has fought, struggled and won.
And continues to struggle daily. Yeah, I am there too. :shock:

This is how I learn to be a human and I would always want to be teachable.
There is a difference between ego and self-esteem. Ego can be a false-confidence to bolster a poor sense of self-esteem. If we have a high self-esteem, we have a secure self-confidence and don't really need a large ego to feel better about ourselves or our situation.

My life story is different every time I tell it, as different parts of my experiences have more importance on some days than others. Eventually, I have to look at all of it. There will be parts of it I like and parts of it I don't like. I have the freedom to choose who I want to be.
One of the most difficult things for me was to find out who I was. Fear and shame had blocked me from growth for many years. I hid from others.
I had to learn that I had something to offer, but I had to come out of my shell in order to share it. I had to listen to how others did it, because my way wasn't working out very well for me. We all have worth. Each of us together.
We all do. :D
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Re: The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby Manners73 » Mon May 25, 2020 2:49 pm

Akuma wrote:
Manners73 wrote:This is something I've been stewing over of late.

I don't think it's something that's exclusive only to personality disorders but I've found that within the lists of characteristics there are a lot of contradictions.
It's like we want something and at the same time we don't.
I wanna be adored then when people like me I push them away.
I wanna be special but I'm the first to stand up and tell people that I'm anything but special.

Do you get what I mean?


I think this is a few different things being conflated, things that might look the same but in reality are not. But on the very basic level I would say that - maybe in a comparable development to your insight in regards to your relationships mentioned in the post about love - there at least seems to be a growing awareness of these opposing states and of inner ambivalence developing in you lately.


Yeah I'm going through some kind of stage in my life whereas I'm trying to take responsibility for what I am and what I'm not.

I know that having a PD is a permanent feature of myself and its something that I'dime to learn more about in order to be a better person. I don't wanna see it as an obstacle to my progress. I wanna see it as an aid.

-- Mon May 25, 2020 2:56 pm --

justonemoreperson wrote:I think it's all about trust and confidence.

Woody Allen said, "Why would I join a club that would have someone like me as a member?"

If you have low confidence in yourself then you'll have a low impression of people who gravitate towards you; you'll be suspicious of their motives.

Admiration in itself is pointless. Admiration that comes from you achieving something is recognition of an achievement, so admiration cannot be a goal that will give you any satisfaction, because the goal should be achieving something, not the admiration, as this will come as a welcome side-effect.

People like Elon Musk and Richard Branson etc, they don't have "getting rich" as a goal. They have a desire to create something valuable, and the by-product of that is that they become rich. There's drive and passion behind what they do. Without them, the transient states of being admired become empty and fleeting.

You want to be adored and like the feeling? Do something to be adored for.
You want to be special? Do something special.

Your therapist sounds like a flake.


Reading this got me thinking. I'm thinking that my sense of entitlement and supremacy are just a grand illusion that helps me to get past the feeling of being scummy.

My therapist is a bit flaky but I like her. She's got that empathy thing going on. She'll do until I get a new one.

The main thing is is that I can talk to her. I can say what I feel like saying so she can't be all that bad but I know that she can't help me with the ptsd.
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Re: The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby Manners73 » Mon May 25, 2020 3:01 pm

Esmoke wrote:My general impression of this post as a whole is that of a very complicated set of circumstances. There is likely a lot going on beneath the surface to motivate these things. I find it more helpful to try and tackle small problems that are bothering you rather than trying to take on an entire condition at once. The psychology behind these symptoms will be revealed through the psychotherapy process. It takes time for this to happen, most good therapists look beyond symptoms towards the ideology or motivators behind them in order to understand them properly.


Yeah that's the thing. She's ready told me that she's out of her depth but she's happy to still see me until all the lock down has finished and I can get someone more fitted for me.

She just let's me lead the session. I make a plan of what I'm going to say the day before and I just take it from there. She's nice but as JOMP said she is weak. A good listener though and I find that just talking has done me some good. At the very least it's helping me to think about things and process things.

-- Mon May 25, 2020 3:06 pm --

Wally58 wrote:When I first began the 12 steps and listening to how other people got themselves better, I was told to try not to judge or compare myself to what other people were saying, what they had done or who they were. That could get my mindset into thinking that 'I was not like that' or 'I would never do that'.

Instead, I was told to try and relate to them as they told their life story. I could choose snippets I could use to improve myself and discard the rest.
Dropping my defenses and baring my soul, reaching out and connecting to another soul who has fought, struggled and won.
And continues to struggle daily. Yeah, I am there too. :shock:

This is how I learn to be a human and I would always want to be teachable.
There is a difference between ego and self-esteem. Ego can be a false-confidence to bolster a poor sense of self-esteem. If we have a high self-esteem, we have a secure self-confidence and don't really need a large ego to feel better about ourselves or our situation.

My life story is different every time I tell it, as different parts of my experiences have more importance on some days than others. Eventually, I have to look at all of it. There will be parts of it I like and parts of it I don't like. I have the freedom to choose who I want to be.
One of the most difficult things for me was to find out who I was. Fear and shame had blocked me from growth for many years. I hid from others.
I had to learn that I had something to offer, but I had to come out of my shell in order to share it. I had to listen to how others did it, because my way wasn't working out very well for me. We all have worth. Each of us together.
We all do. :D


My life story changes a lot as well but Im still the same person in it all. I don't really talk about irl because of the way it changes.
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Re: The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby Squaredonutwheels » Tue May 26, 2020 9:10 am

Manners73 wrote:This is something I've been stewing over of late.

I don't think it's something that's exclusive only to personality disorders but I've found that within the lists of characteristics there are a lot of contradictions.



hmmmn

aphorism of Heraclitus:

The road up and the road down are the same thing. (Hippolytus, Refutations 9.10.3)

-- Tue May 26, 2020 8:17 pm --

is the glass half full or half empty or is it both or neither?
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Re: The Paradox Of The Personality Disorder

Postby Manners73 » Tue May 26, 2020 5:38 pm

It's always half full for me.
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