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Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

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Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby easiersaidthandone » Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:36 am

When alone, I fantasize success about anything and everything. If I'm listening to a good song I'll picture myself performing it on stage and doing it better than anyone's ever done it. Especially when watching movies - I put myself in the movie and how I'd do things better or be more successful than the main character. I also fantasize a lot about serial killing or just generally going around causing havoc and destruction. The latter fantasy was especially strong in jail. My fantasies involve having fame/infamy, power, and/or success. Nothing to do with being seen in a good light or as good - just different and special. These fantasies are in the moment and thinking about them in my head satisfies the desire and makes me feel like I accomplished something.

Moving on, wherever I am, I have a need to come off as different from everyone else around me. This manifests as "having" different opinions than others and being antagonistic to other's views just for the sake of debating and have no problem effectively arguing both sides of any discussion and winning(at least in my head I always win). I'll openly disrespect authority if everyone else is a follower or the reverse, speak good on an "enemy" of the group. I'll also alter personality traits like in jail developing a more formal, thoughtful persona to separate me from the more brash, loud, and low intelligence criminals. Or the opposite, behaving more like a fun jerk while in a group of polite people.

Whatever happens, I need to win. I place personal power above everything else; especially in interpersonal relationships. I use calculated aggression to make sure I get my way or at least change the terms so I get some level of control and yeah that's still a win. Not always possible to control a situation but if I can't then oh well move on. Having a person escape my metaphorical chains is one of the few ways to anger me. When that happens of course I work on getting that back into my hypnosis. Though while losing something important to me will cause a flash of anger I never let emotions show because losing control is weakness, much less chase after the object. As such I come off as a rock and described as methodical. In jail fellow inmates called me a serial killer because according to them I was too calm all the time and had no feelings or emotions and that I looked like one day I would snap and beat someone to death. I certaintly do, I just don't behave like I do, because of my level of control. Closest I'll be seen behaving emotionally is when I use anger to make a point or get something.

I've been consistently described as every narcissistic word out there. Arrogant, grandiose, egotistical, etc. I will say in my core I've always viewed myself as superior - but it doesn't manifest overtly as haughty, cocky behavior nor blindly thinking I can do anything.

From my readings NPD worry about other's perceptions and feel a lot of emotions I don't. I also don't seek validation the way a typical narcissist seems to. I don't like being complimented or people being kind or touchy with me. It's annoying. I don't like people getting too clingy, following me around, or looking up to me as a superior. People who try to kiss my ass are weak. So, I don't particularly chase admiration, attention, unless I'm bored but not to regulate ego. I get my kicks and gratification from controlling people actions, perceptions, and emotions. I regularly ask people to do increasingly bigger favors because I like to push boundaries.

That was quite a bit of info. Those with good knowledge on the core of NPD, do I seem to fit in your opinions?

P.s: I've been dx'ed with Aspd on several occasions and never has a clinician mentioned narcissism other than one mentioning grandiosity.
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Re: Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby Akuma » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:39 am

Sounds to me like your ASPD diagnosis fits best. If its oriented more around a schizoid or a narcissists core is hard to say. I would say the problems with emotions and the way fantasies work for you point more towards the schizoid range though.
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Re: Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby justonemoreperson » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:04 am

@OP

Most of what you describe could apply to the few highly successful people who go on to invent stuff like cool electric cars and send them into space. The only problem is that the curve of effectiveness slopes up to a point and then drops away dramatically, which is why you ended up sitting in jail.

Your possibly great potential has been stirred in with an unhealthy amount of useless arsehole. I don't mean that to sound offensive, as I'm much the same, but it takes a while to spot the constantly repeating pattern and look for a way to control it.

Visualisation, as you're described, is an effective tool. Use it to find other mechanisms to deal with situations. Otherwise you'll lose.
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Re: Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby HSS » Mon Dec 02, 2019 10:26 am

I assume that most narcissists like being complimented/admired, at least for things they value as admirable.
Btw I don't agree that someone being kind with you is always weak, it depends on his motivations; he's weak someone that is going along with you, betraying his nature or his willing.
But if someone is kind with you, even if you openly show that you don't like kind people, he is just following his willing and his attitude, despite you dislike them.
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Re: Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby justonemoreperson » Mon Dec 02, 2019 11:17 am

There's a tendency to believe that kind people are weak and they finish last etc. but I'm not sure if this is true.

They're obviously going to be used at some point, but the majority of the time they won't. If you look at the big picture, I'm pretty sure that kindness, on average, leads to a person's success rather than their failure.

It's basically a barter system, the more you're kind to other people, the more likely they are to be kind to you. It's no different to any other social contract we follow, and yet this is seen as weak to some.

I think people are often so paranoid about being conned, that they sacrifice any opportunity for it to happen, even though the chances of it happening are very low.

My mother was a good example of kindness. She's was very kind and, as such, she'd give everyone the benefit of the doubt and occasionally she got stiffed. Not in a major way, but enough for her to feel stupid.

But she never really had to pay for much. She had friends who'd help her out, a builder who did a whole pile of work on her garden for her because she was there for his sister when she was ill.

People took her on holiday, even paid for her to travel to South America for a holiday when my father died. So, yeah, she might have been shafted for a couple of hundred now and then, but if you look at it as a cost / benefit analysis, she won.
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Re: Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby ZeroZ » Mon Dec 02, 2019 12:28 pm

Agree with jomp, you can outmaneuver people and use them as a means to an end but ultimately this will catch up to you and blow up in your face if you can get people to genuinely like you they will do far more for you and not leave you high and dry when the day comes (and it comes for us all) that you have no means at all.

I talk about how much I dislike humans and civilization but that’s probably an over exaggeration because I don’t mind helping people who really deserve it, I just don’t think most people do. If I had the option to help or piss on someone, one was nice and helpful to me and one was a chore to be around and never helped anyone in their lives guess who gets the help and who gets the piss.
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Re: Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby easiersaidthandone » Mon Dec 02, 2019 1:37 pm

justonemoreperson wrote:I think people are often so paranoid about being conned, that they sacrifice any opportunity for it to happen, even though the chances of it happening are very low.


It's more about lacking a real desire to be kind in turn. Doesn't mean I won't reciprocate, I will at times, but in my head I understand is a means to an end and not something I really want to do.

When I get kind and giving people to repeatedly do things for me even though I've never reciprocated much but it's just their nature to do so it makes me believe this person is some kind of stupid. I gravitate towards kind people because they are more willing to give and I do recognize that people like that tend to be very happy and fulfilled; but I could never be like that and I would not like to be like that as I'd have to sacrifice personal gain and put more effort in others than I'm capable.

Imagine your own attentional difficulties affecting work and school, but have it apply towards people aswell. I have that.
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Re: Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby justonemoreperson » Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:12 pm

easiersaidthandone wrote:Imagine your own attentional difficulties affecting work and school, but have it apply towards people aswell. I have that.


Same problem; being able to argue the benefit is a lot different to making it work. Part of the problem is that most people are really boring and not worth the effort.

It's easy to see the benefit if it's immediate, but having to put in effort in lieu of some vague reward sometime in the future, possibly? No thanks; I'd rather be a c*nt.

My parents took me to church in my early teens, I think as a last-ditch effort to make a difference, and I loved it. The people expected that you were nice and assumed you were good. It was like my birthday and Christmas rolled into one.

I stole the wine, money from the collection plates, stuff that people left lying around. They were nice and they were naturally trusting. Add a charismatic, roguish personality and I got away with anything.

I went to spiritual youth retreats, f*cked some bird who wanted to be a nun, took a silver cup from the convent or whatever it was called, and on it goes.

All because the expectation was that people were good and they didn't see it coming.

Short term, they lost. Long term? Well, I don't know how it turned out for any of them, but they probably have friends and relatives who still talk to them.

And, given the chance, knowing what I know now? I'd do the exact same thing again. It was ######6 awesome. Better to burn out than fade away.
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Re: Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby easiersaidthandone » Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:51 am

Akuma wrote:Sounds to me like your ASPD diagnosis fits best. If its oriented more around a schizoid or a narcissists core is hard to say. I would say the problems with emotions and the way fantasies work for you point more towards the schizoid range though.


What makes them appear more schizoid than narcy? Would you say people tend to have both coping mechanisms but one used more than the other?
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Re: Fantasies & Other Possible Narcissistic Traits

Postby Akuma » Wed Dec 04, 2019 9:54 am

What makes them appear more schizoid than narcy? Would you say people tend to have both coping mechanisms but one used more than the other?


Suppressed affect or an inability to feel emotions is not an aspect of NPD, where emotional perception and range is typically unaffected. Thats really more an aspect of certain strands of dissociativity, psychosis-spectrum disorders and also - if not always - in SPD. Might also be a general aspect of ASPD though, I dunno much about that.
Grandiose fantasies etc. or a fantasy-life like you describe is more typical for SPD. pwNPD also may have grandiose fantasies, but the quality is rather different I'd think. SPD is on the one hand side more about an inner retreat and the fantasies can be rather elaborate stories, while the narcissistic fantasies I would see as much moer ad-hoc and more towarsd the end of "unrealistic expectations". In addition SPD types seem - from what Ive read - to orient much more towards being "different", than NPD types; so unlike the [cliche] type NPD that needs others to tell them how amazing they are, SPD doesnt want others to tell him what they are at all, they dont want others to define them. So in general if theres a quality of "splitting off" I'd say thats more SPD, while NPD internally are orienting more towards integrating / merging others into their grandiose perception. My 2c.


Would you say people tend to have both coping mechanisms but one used more than the other?


Nah, I dont think "normal" people would use schizoid defenses, or maybe even anrcissistic defenses. Schizoid defenses are per definition indicative of some low-level organization, or in other words you'd be borderlinish or schizoid or something, not normal aka neurotic, to use them. Narcissistic defenses tbh I'M not sure what that would be, as there seem to be conflicting ideas about it. Just like with the former though I'd think that, if its about restoring grandiose self-perception, that might happen when the person is actively regressed, maybe due to some trauma or shock situation or something.
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