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Is it worth fixing NPD? And how?

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Re: Is it worth fixing NPD? And how?

Postby Jean33 » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:53 pm

Aals wrote:It would be very interesting to know how psychedelics or MDMA can help people who have personality disorders. At this point the results for treating PTSD or depression are quite promising, but more research is needed. Maybe they could help people with PDs as well.


I hear that they can provoke a kind of Ego-Death. I don't know if it is a good idea if you have a fragile self, can maybe do more harm than good no?
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Re: Is it worth fixing NPD? And how?

Postby notaspecialperson » Tue Jul 17, 2018 11:39 am

Jean33 wrote:
Aals wrote:It would be very interesting to know how psychedelics or MDMA can help people who have personality disorders. At this point the results for treating PTSD or depression are quite promising, but more research is needed. Maybe they could help people with PDs as well.

I hear that they can provoke a kind of Ego-Death. I don't know if it is a good idea if you have a fragile self, can maybe do more harm than good no?

I like to think that my experiences with MDMA have helped me with my NPD issues, I know that they helped me with my social anxiety issues, and 'discovering that I was lovable'. When you are on MDMA, you feel much more comfortable being vulnerable with those around you, leading to a great feeling of connection. That said narcissistic behaviour and thoughts can also feel better when you are on MDMA. If you take it with the intention of being vulnerable with some friends, for example by discussing feelings of shame, or with physical affection, then I like to think that it would help a person with NPD a great deal. I haven't actually taken it since realising I was NPD and getting treatment, so I'm pretty keen to see what it's like now.
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Re: Is it worth fixing NPD? And how?

Postby Chemuel » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:06 pm

To throwawayayerye - yes, it's worth "fixing" or rather, tackling. For those around You, obviously. For Yourself, as things change drastically. For me the effect was a lot like attaining another sense when my emotions started reconnecting. Mainly though, my experience, most narcs will, at some point, break. I did. My mother did. "Friends" did. A single situation confronting me (or them) with lack of control can shatter the mask and then it's a downward spiral for two to five years until You're done with life. I'd strongly suggest finding a good therapist and getting diagnosed. If it's actually NPD, prevent the reason most narcs end up in therapy at all - the eventual depression, substance abuse, rage-resulting-in-incarceration-moments, etc. Incidentally You might improve Your life and that of those close to You.

On MDMA, ego-death and entheogenesis. Probably should get its own topic. My personal experience - that stuff turns into another problem really fast, and is not terribly helpful. It may help to alleviate the symptoms for a while (till it turns into an addiction) but I was not myself then either, the connections felt real as compared to my usual perception, but were really hollow. Ego-death is a well documented phenomenon across history, the "mystic" is someone who has experienced a moment of subject/object congruence, meaning he "felt" the world being one big process beyond time and himself a part of that. Usually a flash of a few hours and echoing for about a week. Changes things permanently. Different thought patterns. Different perception. However, the feeling leaves and the state of mind is impermanent. Don't have the links, but to my knowledge the only substance to create this effect "artificially" was LSD in about 10% of the cases, while there is no documentation on how these individuals differed from others before the experience.
Now here's something personal as well. Never trust a narc claiming to be special but I had this experience due to psychological trauma. Quite amazing, really. But does nothing to fix the narc issue. Again, from personal experience, no substance really fixed me or helped me fix anything. Always turned out worse in the end. (Did not experiment with K-hole "treatment" that is also being researched currently.) I strongly suggest not trying that.
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Re: Is it worth fixing NPD? And how?

Postby Aals » Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:40 am

MDMA is an interesting topic because MAPS is researching it´s effect in treating PTSD. I have heard some arguments that people with NPD actually have complex PTSD because they were abused by their own disordered parents and therefore their pathological narcissism is just an extremely dysfunctional way of coping with these symptoms.
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Re: Is it worth fixing NPD? And how?

Postby cubem0n » Thu Sep 20, 2018 1:05 am

Aals wrote:MDMA is an interesting topic because MAPS is researching it´s effect in treating PTSD. I have heard some arguments that people with NPD actually have complex PTSD because they were abused by their own disordered parents and therefore their pathological narcissism is just an extremely dysfunctional way of coping with these symptoms.


I remember having read somewhere (user experiences on a different forum) that MDMA alone won't help pwNPDs. The recipe that seemed to work, was to first eat a huge amount of psilocybin mushrooms, and after a few days would be MDMA's turn.

Even though the aforementioned method is purely anecdotal, it seems somewhat intuitive to me, considering that MDMA removes the fear of accessing traumatizing memories. However, I believe the fear is absolutely necessary to be experienced as it originally manifested (hence the mushrooms first with their terror-inducing effects), in order for any healing to happen.
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Re: Is it worth fixing NPD? And how?

Postby cubem0n » Fri Sep 21, 2018 12:45 am

Aals wrote:It would be very interesting to know how psychedelics or MDMA can help people who have personality disorders. At this point the results for treating PTSD or depression are quite promising, but more research is needed. Maybe they could help people with PDs as well.


Aals, are you interested in only scientifically backed information, or are you also satisifed with anecdotal reports? I have tried some psychedelics for a longer period of time trying to understand myself. Actually magic mushrooms + internet made me realize I have covert NPD, a few years back.

Even though I would like to give mushrooms all the praise for their effectiveness, I simply can't do that. They made me understand a lot, but also fortified my false self so much, that it is now the size of Jupiter.

I believe that most of the substances are only temporary relief for pwNPDs. Nowadays I just prefer cannabis and micro-dosing of ketamine to do that. Also ibogaine has given hope for a real cure, but constant micro-dosing should occur to keep the metabolites in the bloodstream 24/7.

This discussion truly needs its own thread, indeed. Sorry to loan this thread in a brash way. :)
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Re: Is it worth fixing NPD? And how?

Postby realityhere » Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:11 am

cubem0n,

I understand that some pwNPD seek psychedelic solutions to the anxiety/depression issues they experience, as do others without PD's for the same issues. Such psychedelics as you've mentioned have not yet been proven a panacea or cure for NPD or other PD's themselves unfortunately. Some psychedelics do help with self-awareness of a PD, sometimes with much clarity, but also sometimes exacerbating the false image/ego problem.

You mention the drugs ketamine and ibogaine which should be prescribed and monitored by a physician. I hope you're not using these drugs on a recreational/experimental basis. Ketamine, in particular and considered an anesthetic, can have peculiar side effects if not carefully monitored by a qualified doctor. Please realize what works for you may not work for others, as individuals vary in response to psychedelics and drugs.

MDMA research is only in beginning stages. Research has revealed that MDMA has helped many with PTSD issues, however, it still remains whether MDMA can help pwNPD or other personality disorders effectively. There have been previous posts about MDMA here on this forum.

And yes, this is a thread for that discussion, if members wish. Just remember to use a disclaimer.
AWAY from mod duties, please contact another moderator.
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Re: Is it worth fixing NPD? And how?

Postby cubem0n » Sat Sep 22, 2018 3:08 pm

realityhere, thanks for the heads-up. I hope my future posts will become more reasonable, after I've acquired a formal diagnosis. Hoping for that to happen soon, anyway.

realityhere wrote:cubem0n,
You mention the drugs ketamine and ibogaine which should be prescribed and monitored by a physician. I hope you're not using these drugs on a recreational/experimental basis. Ketamine, in particular and considered an anesthetic, can have peculiar side effects if not carefully monitored by a qualified doctor. Please realize what works for you may not work for others, as individuals vary in response to psychedelics and drugs.


My apologies, I might have been too vague here. Ibogaine I've never used, just dreamt of it. Even though I'm aware of the necessity of a physician around these treatments, my paranoid side keeps me from trusting any doctors or psychiatrists. I'm careful, however. I also have this twisted idea in my head, that true pwNPD is unable to become a substance addict, because the only real addiction is the one requiring excessive admiration, or "narcissistic supply", if you will. Practically this means that a pwNPD would be ready to manufacture a substance addiction just to feed his/her primary addiction. Going for the gold, so to speak.

Yes, I tend to generalize my behaviours a great deal. Have to watch out for that.

realityhere wrote:MDMA research is only in beginning stages. Research has revealed that MDMA has helped many with PTSD issues, however, it still remains whether MDMA can help pwNPD or other personality disorders effectively. There have been previous posts about MDMA here on this forum.

And yes, this is a thread for that discussion, if members wish. Just remember to use a disclaimer.


Alrighty, I will check those posts.
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