New - Need help with therapist's

We were with a therapist for about a year who didn't know much about DID but she tried. She allowed for us to email her between sessions and this helped. Last month she transferred us to a new therapist who specializes in DID. Our "host" is in denial which isn't helpful. This new therapist doesn't allow emails, which will hinder rather than help us. Is this normal for a therapist to not allow emails? How do nonverbal parts "talk" then?

The other issue is that our old therapist offered to be our friend. This has proved to be difficult. I know this is wrong for all kinds of reasons. Its been confusing and difficult to process. We can't tell the new therapist since they both work in the same office and we don't want to get our old therapist in trouble but this new relationship is proving to be super tricky. On one hand she started to try to be friends. We exchanged playlists and stuff and then she said we needed to get back to "work". She's told others that she can't be our therapist AND friend. But has told others that "nothing has changed. That we (her and us) are still on the same team and working towards the same goal". Which felt like she was saying she is still our therapist..

But that we need to let the new therapist be the therapist except nobody trusts the new therapist. Nobody has talked with her because she only sees our "host" who denies. Our old therapist has said various things like she would read the kids a story and send it or come see us and read it, etc and then never follows through. Makes excuses. She had told the kids prior to leaving that she would still visit with them from time to time but now we are realizing that she either lied or was just saying that to placate them. The kids have since then been tucked away and our protector will not allow them to have contact with her. (she doesn't know this) And feels like she is a trickster like all adults are and cannot be trusted.

This is a side of her we didn't know. As our therapist, she was trustworthy and kept her word and followed through but as a "friend" she is showing us she is not trustworthy, doesn't follow through and says things that aren't true. Its just so confusing and scary to learn this about her. It would be better if we had made a connection with the new therapist already but that isn't likely to happen very soon. I know our old therapist is frustrated by this but that isn't how trust works. It takes TIME. It feels all over the place. And because it now feels all over the place its also becoming confusing on whether or not her "picking" this new therapist was a good idea. Maybe all therapists are bad and not trustworthy. Maybe they all lie. Its very confusing.

We don't want to lose our old therapist because she does respond to texts and emails and is fairly responsive for the most part but the times that she has fallen through those seem magnified and focused on vs everything else that she has done for us and continues to do for us...without pay. And if we lost her I don't know if we would survive that. so maybe we have to just settle for confusion and chaos as her "friend".

Maybe just talking it out loud here will help. Although posting this will feel like we are betraying her but there is no other place to talk about it. I hope this is safe. I also hope someone responds.

DMT

Hi DMT,

We've had two really good therapists (and a bunch of not so good ones). The good ones were really different people but both of them had BOUNDARIES. That's super important. Confused therapists make us confused. Confusion messes everything up. If your old therapist won't have boundaries then you need to have them with her. Maybe she doesn't know it but she's hurting you.

Iain & Colin

One thing I did with the first therapist I had and I had doubts on their behavior was just read lists of warning signs, she had a couple. and I thought on it. I know it must be hard cause you don't trust the therapist you have and this other one is showing attention to you, but I have learned to be very distrustful of free attention in scenarios like these, it just doesn't make sense. Therapists aren't supposed to be friends to you, but supposed to be someone who helps you see your own issues. If they aren't holding up these really good boundaries then they aren't gonna be able to do that. Now i don't think I would be worried about a few interactions to just check in and see you are doing ok, but idk, after that it seems problematic.
Also I think you need to focus and think if the new one is gonna work and really think if the problems with them are something that can be worked through with time, or if you should move on. I just started therapy and I already know I hate changing therapists cause of starting over, effort etc. But like is the old one being there also making it harder for you to genuinely move on to this newer one and give them a chance? Anyways, sorry to hear you are having this problem. Sounds confusing.

Is this normal for a therapist to not allow emails? How do nonverbal parts "talk" then?

Each therapist set their boundaries differently. Some doesn't allow emails at all, some allows emails for emergency, some allow emails or not depending on the patient and how they respect/need boundaries, some allow emails only at some hours, or allow emails but will answer to them only during session, etc.

Allowing emails, text messages and calls can be a risky thing for a therapist. Some patients can take adventage of that to overwhelm their boundaries and use it as a way to replay traumatic attachment issues. One of my friend at the university did volunteer phone support once (no payment, but with a contract), and ended up with a person who was using the weak points of the contract to call her at 2am, or text her until 3am, threatening to kill herself is my friend didn't answer - which, because of the contract, means this person was in crisis and my friend had to answer, even when it was clear it was only a manipulative move. Because of that person, my friend had to stop her volunteer work.

On a less dramatic scenario, if too many patients email or text a therapist and expect an answer, how the therapist is supposed to rest ? Being available all the time is exhausting and can impact the quality of their work.

Plus, it can be really unhelpful for the patient, as being available too much can make them grow more and more dependent on the therapist. With DID, relying too much on the therapist could also mean not communicating enough with the rest of the system, and missing the opportunity to find a way with the other parts, to learn how to communicate more.

I don't say you would behave like this, those are only examples, but other people can, and each therapist has to come with their own way to deal with this possibility. Not all therapists are the same, that's why they need different boundaries. Depending on the therapist, one person behaving like this could mean the therapist will be so overwhelmed they would be less available for their other patients

Your new therapist knows her limits and has boundaries to protect herself and be available for her patients. That's good, even if it doesn't feel like that right now. And if she's really good, you can still ask her if she has ideas for the non-verbal parts, or for emergencies, and you can think about it yourself too. Making compromises and finding new ways to express yourselves is part of the therapy.

The other issue is that our old therapist offered to be our friend. [...] Our old therapist has said various things like she would read the kids a story and send it or come see us and read it, etc and then never follows through. Makes excuses. [...] everything else that she has done for us and continues to do for us...without pay.

This, on the other hand, makes me feel like your old therapist might not have proper boundaries. That's maybe why things seems easy with her, but also why it's confusing. That's not how therapy, or even friendship, works. You need to have boundaries, especially as a therapist, so your patients can learn from you how to set their own.

Therapists aren't here to be our friend, they are here to work for us, with us. That's why the symbolic of payment is important. Doing a free job without clear expectations of what could or will happen is confusing as hell, both for the therapist and for the patient.


If you don't feel like letting the old therapist go, you don't have to, or you can take your time. If you don't trust your new therapist, it's okay, as you said, trust take time. But don't judge the new one from the old one. If you come to the point you want to stop with the new one, it has to be because of the new one, not because she's not like your old therapist.

IainEtc wrote:Hi DMT,

We've had two really good therapists (and a bunch of not so good ones). The good ones were really different people but both of them had BOUNDARIES. That's super important. Confused therapists make us confused. Confusion messes everything up. If your old therapist won't have boundaries then you need to have them with her. Maybe she doesn't know it but she's hurting you.

Iain & Colin

That is a good point. I know the old therapist didn't/doesn't have good boundaries. Even she has admitted that. She did in the beginning but then something happened (I don't know what) and she maybe started to lose her objectivity. She said that she had let her feelings get in the way of helping us which made it so she couldn't help us anymore. I wonder if that will happen with the new therapist and I wonder what we could do to help that not happen. Yes. She is hurting us. She doesn't know it but parts are hiding and don't want to talk to her because they no longer trust the things she says. There are only 2 or 3 that will talk with her anymore. If she knew this, it would make her mad because of "everything she has done for us". That's the problem with stuff like that. It comes with strings attached.

Thank you for talking with me.

DMT

spinningtops wrote:One thing I did with the first therapist I had and I had doubts on their behavior was just read lists of warning signs, she had a couple. and I thought on it. I know it must be hard cause you don't trust the therapist you have and this other one is showing attention to you, but I have learned to be very distrustful of free attention in scenarios like these, it just doesn't make sense. Therapists aren't supposed to be friends to you, but supposed to be someone who helps you see your own issues. If they aren't holding up these really good boundaries then they aren't gonna be able to do that. Now i don't think I would be worried about a few interactions to just check in and see you are doing ok, but idk, after that it seems problematic.
Also I think you need to focus and think if the new one is gonna work and really think if the problems with them are something that can be worked through with time, or if you should move on. I just started therapy and I already know I hate changing therapists cause of starting over, effort etc. But like is the old one being there also making it harder for you to genuinely move on to this newer one and give them a chance? Anyways, sorry to hear you are having this problem. Sounds confusing.

In all honesty, I have bounced this thought back and forth as to whether the old one sticking around is making it hard to connect with the new one. She had said if we had problems or was concerned about things with the new one, we could talk to her about it and she would help us with those questions but the few times any one has said anything to her she gets all defensive and says things that are hurtful. She told one us that we were "so freaking paranoid" (in relation to not trusting people). Which is rude. We don't trust people for GOOD REASONS.

Changing therapists is so hard. I don't know if we want to do it again or just stop for now. Now that we are finding out the old one was only trustworthy when we were paying her and not as a friend it feels like she wasn't trustworthy at all. It was an illusion. Maybe trust isn't real. Maybe it doesn't really exist and why risk that with anyone else?

Thank you for responding and helping us process this.

DMT

Dwelt wrote:

Is this normal for a therapist to not allow emails? How do nonverbal parts "talk" then?

Each therapist set their boundaries differently. Some doesn't allow emails at all, some allows emails for emergency, some allow emails or not depending on the patient and how they respect/need boundaries, some allow emails only at some hours, or allow emails but will answer to them only during session, etc.

Allowing emails, text messages and calls can be a risky thing for a therapist. Some patients can take adventage of that to overwhelm their boundaries and use it as a way to replay traumatic attachment issues. One of my friend at the university did volunteer phone support once (no payment, but with a contract), and ended up with a person who was using the weak points of the contract to call her at 2am, or text her until 3am, threatening to kill herself is my friend didn't answer - which, because of the contract, means this person was in crisis and my friend had to answer, even when it was clear it was only a manipulative move. Because of that person, my friend had to stop her volunteer work.

On a less dramatic scenario, if too many patients email or text a therapist and expect an answer, how the therapist is supposed to rest ? Being available all the time is exhausting and can impact the quality of their work.

Plus, it can be really unhelpful for the patient, as being available too much can make them grow more and more dependent on the therapist. With DID, relying too much on the therapist could also mean not communicating enough with the rest of the system, and missing the opportunity to find a way with the other parts, to learn how to communicate more.

I don't say you would behave like this, those are only examples, but other people can, and each therapist has to come with their own way to deal with this possibility. Not all therapists are the same, that's why they need different boundaries. Depending on the therapist, one person behaving like this could mean the therapist will be so overwhelmed they would be less available for their other patients

Your new therapist knows her limits and has boundaries to protect herself and be available for her patients. That's good, even if it doesn't feel like that right now. And if she's really good, you can still ask her if she has ideas for the non-verbal parts, or for emergencies, and you can think about it yourself too. Making compromises and finding new ways to express yourselves is part of the therapy.

The other issue is that our old therapist offered to be our friend. [...] Our old therapist has said various things like she would read the kids a story and send it or come see us and read it, etc and then never follows through. Makes excuses. [...] everything else that she has done for us and continues to do for us...without pay.

This, on the other hand, makes me feel like your old therapist might not have proper boundaries. That's maybe why things seems easy with her, but also why it's confusing. That's not how therapy, or even friendship, works. You need to have boundaries, especially as a therapist, so your patients can learn from you how to set their own.

Therapists aren't here to be our friend, they are here to work for us, with us. That's why the symbolic of payment is important. Doing a free job without clear expectations of what could or will happen is confusing as hell, both for the therapist and for the patient.


If you don't feel like letting the old therapist go, you don't have to, or you can take your time. If you don't trust your new therapist, it's okay, as you said, trust take time. But don't judge the new one from the old one. If you come to the point you want to stop with the new one, it has to be because of the new one, not because she's not like your old therapist.

You bring up really good points regarding email and why she might not allow for it. I don't know if we ever crossed a boundary with our old one emailing her. If we did, she never said anything. We still email her and sometimes she responds and sometimes she doesn't. When she doesn't, it hurts. If she doesn't respond then we can read all kinds of reasons into why that might be. Sometimes we will ask about it and sometimes she gives what seems like a valid excuse for why she didn't answer but then it's like..why email. If we don't respond to her though, she gets really pushy. Which makes no sense.

And I can see why it might take away from inner communication. I will have to think about that. Maybe we will ask her about her ideas for the non-verbal parts even though our instinct is to run from this whole therapy thing and trust.

You are right about not leaving the new one because she isn't like the old one. I don't know that we have really given her a chance. Everything is jumbled up. I wish we could talk to the new one about the old one.. There is lots to process. But with them working for the same agency, I don't know that we could trust the new one not to tell the old one. The old one felt that if she became our friend instead of ending the relationship it would not feel like another abandonment. She was clear she couldn't be our therapist and that we needed to see a "specialist". But with therapy, there are guidelines..parameters. Everyone has a role and knows where they begin and end..this new relationship is so complicated. The old therapist still acts like a therapist and still treats us like a client and not as a friend. It's so confusing. I don't even know if she knows how to be a friend. Maybe we don't either...

Thank you for talking to me and helping us process this.
DMT