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Switching intentionally

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Switching intentionally

Postby birdsong87 » Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:52 pm

Our T tries to teach us how to switch on purpose between Asti and me.
The problem is that I somehow stay front and block the space, so Asti can't get to the front.
The T tried to explain how to 'step back' and I don't have a concept of what she wants. I can't step back from where I am! How is that supposed to work?

Question for those who can switch intentionally at least sometimes... How does the part who is fronting behave? what do they do to move out of the way?

there is a 'trigger' that makes us switch unintentionally. that is when I am exhausted. it just happens then. but we are trying to learn how to take turns without me having to get so exhausted...
Dx: DID cPTSD
L (host 1); Asti (host 2); Annett (teen protector); Maya (child); Age (observer); Thamara (child); Danielle (aut. teen); Mike (caregiver) and others
Our blog on resources https://www.dis-sos.com
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Re: Switching intentionally

Postby Dwelt » Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:47 am

Stepping back was something I had a hard time to learn. We don't have "full switches" (with blackouts) anymore, I'm always there in a way or another (even if I'm not the one who will stock the main memories), which means I can always take the control back if I want to.

Which also mean that I can block the others, and I did it a lot without wanting it at the beginning.

Back at the time, I trusted Daem and I agreed on stepping back, but deep down, I was too scared to be able to let the control go. The feelings of watching my body do things, say things without me being in control of it was too weird, too scary.

It was hard, but to pay more attention, to observe and think about what was going on when I was forced to step back is what helped me to willingly do it. I started to watch what Daem was doing, how I was feeling, what influence I could have. I noticed I still had a bit of control. With some experiment, I finally understood how to just "step beside" another alter in control, and then how to step back.

But being "stuck" or "blocking" the others seems to always be linked to a need for us : need of reassurance, need to be safe, need of being in control to be sure nothing wrong happen, etc. and trying to force a switch without solving the need first never worked.

Hope it helps !
French system

The ones in charge : Plume (Plume+Alix+Lea) | Daemon
The main group : Claude, protector | Kal, protector | Erdian, social-manager

"Little" group : Nicolas | Eric | Jean | Linda | Emma | Nathan | Ethan

The last two : Cassandra | Varegh, protector
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Re: Switching intentionally

Postby SeveralCrows » Sun Oct 18, 2020 2:18 am

We can intentionally switch only some of the time. I don't know if the way we can describe this will be meaningful, but if you have experienced co-consciousness or know what it feels like for someone to be nearby or have been nearby while someone else fronted, then I think it will make sense.

For us, when someone is nearby, that is the space to step back to. The sensation for us is like we are seeing from deeper in space, almost like sitting in the space of the back of the skull. To let someone else come to front who is already nearby, I both try to pull back to this space, but also have interest in what the other part will do when they are out. If I know who it is, from knowing what I do about them, I can make a guess about how they might be about to behave, and thinking about their next actions takes me away from being in the moment enough to let them get a little closer to front. This is a moment where it is necessary to relax, and it takes trust of that other alter and trust that it is okay to let them be in front. It can be really easy to tense up because of feeling like you have to take responsibility alone or because you're afraid of what will happen if you let go of control.

We also know that for some parts, we have positive triggers we can bring out intentionally. This doesn't work all of the time, but there are two parts with specific known positive triggers which work somewhat well. For us these are topics of conversation and specific items. We have heard of a few systems using a specific song or hobby for this also.

I have no idea if this helps. I hope you are able to find some way to switch besides exhaustion.
33F Human Body - Dx'd System of 22+ parts.
System currently being reconfigured. Please stand by.
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Re: Switching intentionally

Postby IainEtc » Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:15 pm

Hi,

Host and I have always kind of switched back and forth because I hang out pretty close to front. Host is like a total social moron so he needs me to handle people sometimes. Switching on purpose is harder for Host with people (inside or outside) he doesn't trust and can't relax around. He will like totally NOT switch to Cody on purpose - the girl thing totally embarrasses him. He can get switchy in T sometimes and sometimes not at all. Sometimes we have to switch before we get to T so we'll get some time.

Anyway switching on purpose doesn't mean we always know WHO we'll switch to. It's just about Host letting himself get all fuzzy and falling into it.

Iain
Iain - 14, Colin - 17, Evan - 7, Cody - 16, Raven, & Host - the adult out front

When they say 'be yourself',
which one do they mean?
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Re: Switching intentionally

Postby birdsong87 » Sun Oct 18, 2020 5:14 pm

The control issue makes sense.
I think we have 2 problems. I am not very familiar with the co-conscious space and Asti doesn't usually front all the way. She just gets as far front as she needs to to use the body but not enough to feel too much through the body. we recently realized that she actually sees our nose in her field of vision. I was never aware of that, it just vanishes when I am front. but it seems ike she stays half a step back and she does see our nose when she looks out.
so it is not just me not knowing how to step back. she is actually also not stepping front all the way.

we tried yesterday with what the T told us, holding an item and then acting like we are giving the item to the other one. I think it actually worked when we tried with the computer mouse. at least so that we were co-present and more of Astis energy was front.
later we tried with other stuff and it only gave us headaches.
also, it all makes me feel pathetic, since or course I am making the DID up... :roll:
Dx: DID cPTSD
L (host 1); Asti (host 2); Annett (teen protector); Maya (child); Age (observer); Thamara (child); Danielle (aut. teen); Mike (caregiver) and others
Our blog on resources https://www.dis-sos.com
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Re: Switching intentionally

Postby SystemFlo » Sun Oct 18, 2020 7:58 pm

I don't know if this is helpful at all, maybe not because the answer to the question asked is I don't know. Would like to, tho. But maybe I can still say something that helps. I thought of sending this day earlier, and now I realize that this is already a bit off, cause you found out what I have to say by yourself too, at least part of it.

When we switch completely I'm either knocked out of consciousness just like that, or have amnesia about how it happened and don't remember anyone coming in front of me or know how it happened. I only remember one time when someone else controlled the body from in front of me, but I also had ability to control, I just chose not to. Simply because it felt stupid to do that when someone is in front of me, and came there on purpose. We only switch fully (the way I have no memory of) at home alone.

That time we weren't home, but still alone in a place where we knew no one else will come to for several days, so it's safe. Sami pushed me to back and was there in front of me. I didn't do anything. I remember suddenly realizing he's there close and next second he had pushed me back. I think he let me keep the ability to control the body too, to not make it feel scary. And because I was not scared, I could let go and didn't do anything, just looked at what he wants do to. Actually I was super curious, because like I told I have no clue what anyone usually does or who's been out and when. He wanted to use the computer I was on, and started to do that. Next thing I know is that I'm waking up from the couch we were on and he's gone. I do remember sleeping, he sometimes make me sleep when he's out. Or maybe I fall in sleep naturally and he doesn't control that, but what ever, me sleeping sitting down is a clue that it might be Sami had been using the body.

My point is, that maybe you don't have to know, or at least not practice alone, Asti can also practice how to push you and step in front. Maybe stepping in front will naturally move you? I don't remember moving anywhere, when I was "moved" from the front, I don't remember I needed to step back literally because of "being pushed".

Which way of doing the switch makes more sense to you two, is probably up to which one of you is "stronger" that way. In our system I have no idea how to let someone out or how to stop them or how to come back. Those things just happen to me. Is it hard if you both try to do your own thing at the same time? You try to give space in consciousness by letting yourself to get blurred, if it starts to feel like that, or give space if you feel a push, and Asti tries to either take control over the consciousness or to step further to front.

If you usually switch by not "coming to front" but rather "coming out" (taking the consciousness in control), maybe that way of practicing makes more sense or may feel easier. Or is the point to keep you also there, while Asti is in control?

Flor


***I can try ask if any of Fourteens (subsystem: a part with DID) knows more about this. They're better at finding each other and getting people out on purpose than I am. Difference is that they do it mostly in inner world, but they have done it also in here, in "outside outside" from their point of view. (Their normal "outside" is inner world, because they do have their own inner worlds as well).

Our most active little, Leon, age 4, seems to be strongest like that. If he wants out, he can push others out also by accident. Leon is part of system Fourteen. But he's 4 and maybe not that good at explaining.
Dx DID
main system:
Flor F adult co-host
Sami M 15-26 (age slider) system manager, defender
(Lucas M 17 caretaker)
etc.

subsystem:
Fourteen M 14 co-host, trauma holder, persecutor:
- random M 14
- Jules M 14
- Leon M 4
- etc.
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Re: Switching intentionally

Postby KitMcDaydream » Thu Oct 22, 2020 7:50 am

I'm the 'Secret self' and have been always been able to switch or influence intentionally. It's easier when an alter is just 'a front' like the one who deals with work who then switches off when thats over and doesn't seem to have a conscious to know they're not having a life when they're not up front. They always believe they are the bodies identity when they are 'in role'.

I can slip into the background so I cam learn what the other alter is learning without them knowing I'm there though I found I tended to unintentionally influence their body language and people are much more aware of body language than they used to be. I noticed it seemed to make the alter up front feel they were lying or covering up for something as they'd 'feel different but not know why', so I'd block them been aware of me so their body language wasn't influenced by any awareness and they operated entirely in the moment with no memory of 'others' that may be able to do things they couldn't.

It's harder with other alters who have developed as 'full alters' from within the inside. Kit also knows how to come up front when they want and block others. Others seem to be triggered out I can push others to the front if something comes up in the real world that current alter can't deal with but I don't want to go out myself eg sending Sioux up front to help Kit out or sending others out 'to test the waters first' then sliding in and taking over when I can see its something I could confidently handle or because there' s no one around 'to see me'

I also pretend to be who others (in real life) are expecting to prevent a switch happening so I can keep control then go back to what I was doing.this is handy for brief occurrences ie answering the door for a delivery to avoid having to switch to who the person at the door is expecting. I have access to Maddie's memories and what she believes she can and can't do and also what she thinks others think.

If I'm not enjoying the experience I can switch myself with a shell alter temporarily. an example maybe if a workman comes who is taking longer than I expected. I may have started off being who he expected to see then realising something was going to the several more hours I can 'leave the body sat there waiting for him to finish' with what I'd call 'an empty mask' They have access to all the information they need to complete the appointment but as soon as we've shut that door and they've gone I can take over again and go back to doing what I wanted.

Maybe I'm what you'd call the 'system operator'? Though in my mind I'm the original who created the others. (Though orginally before we were aware of being 'parts of a system' whoever was up front believed they were the original self at that moment in time)

SS
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Re: Switching intentionally

Postby Sarandipity » Fri Oct 23, 2020 7:59 am

I know of one intentional switch that has happened in my system.

There was a knock at the door. I was present but not up to dealing with the caller. So I asked who was and Paul opened the door.

Basically i take a mental step back. It feels physical, like I've stepped backwards further into the body and naturally a part will step in. If they don't then the overall feel of dissociation happens where everything is misty and I'm not quite with it. Because I have anxiety, don't go out, i have to be able to step back.

For me its necessity so i don't know how you would do it if it's simply something you want to do.

Beth
Monte Carlo or Bust
Rose and Patrick
Batcho and Fortune (twins), Paul and Lilly,
No-one and Peter, Beth and Karen, Mandy and Mouse plus a seperate system of fragments including: rabit and others.
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Re: Switching intentionally

Postby Zor » Fri Oct 23, 2020 2:19 pm

birdsong87 wrote:Our T tries to teach us how to switch on purpose between Asti and me.
The problem is that I somehow stay front and block the space, so Asti can't get to the front.
The T tried to explain how to 'step back' and I don't have a concept of what she wants. I can't step back from where I am! How is that supposed to work?

Question for those who can switch intentionally at least sometimes... How does the part who is fronting behave? what do they do to move out of the way?

there is a 'trigger' that makes us switch unintentionally. that is when I am exhausted. it just happens then. but we are trying to learn how to take turns without me having to get so exhausted...


So one thing that's helped us is music. There's some things that others really like- MCR for Pixie, Disturbed for Angel, any Hebrew worship music for Kaleb or Katya... those things tend to serve as a "positive trigger" for us, and sometimes unexpectedly create switches, but if we're _wanting_ to, these can help draw others forward.

It's not "easy" and I am still struggling with the "stepping back" (I like that wording), too... but something to help bring others forward at the same time tends to help make the transition easier.

MOST times it's just something that happens, IDK how/why...
(Body - Male, 39)
Zor - primary host & main poster
The rest of us: {\Pixie/}, Kaitie-Lynn (aka "Kitten"), Kaleb, Angel, Katya, Satin, Charles, Chloe, Noah, and a few rarely seen
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Re: Switching intentionally

Postby Western » Fri Oct 23, 2020 7:07 pm

I'd like to believe that I do have control over this but when I think about the extreme opposites of certain parts then it's easy to see that this is just wishful thinking. I do know my different personalities and sometimes I know which one I would like to be at any one time but unfortunately it doesn't work out that way. This is more than likely due to environmental factors and me not being able to control that.

I remember once saying to my therapist that I can't plan for anything because I don't know who I will be when the time comes.
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