Our partner

Can you have DID and MD?

Dissociative Identity Disorder message board, open discussion, and online support group.

Moderator: Johnny-Jack

Re: Can you have DID and MD?

Postby SystemFlo » Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:26 pm

I agree with what ArbreMonde said about DID with autism, to me it's also logic why that is. If a baby for example feels pain every time they're touched by the caregivers, they don't know is it because they're abused, or because of difference in their own sensation. It is as traumatizing either way. What baby feels is all that matters, not what was intended. That is what puts the trauma part into the reasons of why to get DID.

At the same time that baby is not able to learn social clues like neurotypical people do, and therefor isn't able to communicate or understand communication from others the way nents are (I don't know if neurotypical is called nent for short in English, but in my language of origin it is, so I'm using that), that adds the No support part to the reasons of DID. It's harder to feel support, if you have problems in communication or social situations for any reason. What's meant to be support for someone with autism, can in fact turn out to be the opposite, because it's a social situation and possibly hugely stressing.

And like already said, people on autism spectrum are more often also abused the way CPS understands abuse, and there's several reasons why and several sources of possible abuse. Still, even if all the people around the child on spectrum do everything "right", the differences autism itself causes make it possible that what looks to be totally normal and with best intentions, can still be traumatizing to a child on spectrum. Since the way of understanding world is so different in some aspects between nents and autistic people, and we do know trauma isn't an event but a reaction in person, it's totally understandable that even what's normal to one person can be severely traumatizing to other one. And that's for all people, with or without neurological differences before trauma. And I don't say that to claim that the reason for DID is always in autism itself, I'm just making same point than everywhere else too: we shouldn't compare reasons of trauma to find out whether someone has DID or not. It's not how it's diagnosed. What ever has happened to the person, they do have DID if they do have distinct parts and amnesia between them.

Maybe they mean MD can be in people that don't necessarily also have DID? But people with DID can also have MD.


Yes, that's how I understand it. But I thought by myself also about if there are two different conditions, that look like same from the outside, but one is neurological and other one is dissociative. Since daydreaming is classified to be normal dissociation, I don't see why excessive daydreaming couldn't be still dissociation.

Zor, there's nothing in your story that would suggest at slightest that you have MD. Daydreaming isn't same thing than having an inner world. Difference is, that real parts also live when you don't know about it. They live their lives in their world without you having any ability to control it, control their actions and so on. Daydreamers have full control what they dream about and what happens in the fantasy, they do it knowingly and when they don't do it, in that fantasy world nothing happens, because it genuinely isn't real, like inner world in DID is more real. And that is also if you do learn to build things in DID inner world. Think about the parts. You can't decide what they like or think or feel. Daydreamer lives in fantasy, that is fully controlled by them. Only the amount of doing that grows to be too much to continue normal life with it. The amount of fantasy is what's out of control, but what happens in it, is in control. That's why it's a good place to escape to, totally safe, even if it's not a happy place.

Flor
Dx DID
main system:
Flor F adult co-host
Sami M 15-26 (age slider) system manager, defender
(Lucas M 17 caretaker)
etc.

subsystem:
Fourteen M 14 co-host, trauma holder, persecutor:
- random M 14
- Jules M 14
- Leon M 4
- etc.
User avatar
SystemFlo
Consumer 6
Consumer 6
 
Posts: 1171
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:50 pm
Local time: Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:49 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)


ADVERTISEMENT

Re: Can you have DID and MD?

Postby Zor » Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:29 pm

SystemFlo wrote:Zor, there's nothing in your story that would suggest at slightest that you have MD. Daydreaming isn't same thing than having an inner world. Difference is, that real parts also live when you don't know about it. They live their lives in their world without you having any ability to control it, control their actions and so on. Daydreamers have full control what they dream about and what happens in the fantasy, they do it knowingly and when they don't do it, in that fantasy world nothing happens, because it genuinely isn't real, like inner world in DID is more real. And that is also if you do learn to build things in DID inner world. Think about the parts. You can't decide what they like or think or feel. Daydreamer lives in fantasy, that is fully controlled by them. Only the amount of doing that grows to be too much to continue normal life with it. The amount of fantasy is what's out of control, but what happens in it, is in control. That's why it's a good place to escape to, totally safe, even if it's not a happy place.

Flor


Thanks. We're told by too many it's "not real" and it's "just daydreaming/make believe", etc. We're told it's just fantasy...

It is nice to have reassurance from others familiar with all this. Thank you very much!
(Body - Male, 39)
Zor - primary host & main poster
The rest of us: {\Pixie/}, Kaitie-Lynn (aka "Kitten"), Kaleb, Angel, Katya, Satin, Charles, Chloe, Noah, and a few rarely seen
User avatar
Zor
Consumer 6
Consumer 6
 
Posts: 1531
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 12:32 pm
Local time: Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:49 am
Blog: View Blog (1)

Re: Can you have DID and MD?

Postby TheGangsAllHere » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:17 pm

SystemFlo wrote:Daydreaming isn't same thing than having an inner world. Difference is, that real parts also live when you don't know about it. They live their lives in their world without you having any ability to control it, control their actions and so on. Daydreamers have full control what they dream about and what happens in the fantasy, they do it knowingly and when they don't do it, in that fantasy world nothing happens, because it genuinely isn't real, like inner world in DID is more real. And that is also if you do learn to build things in DID inner world. Think about the parts. You can't decide what they like or think or feel. Daydreamer lives in fantasy, that is fully controlled by them. Only the amount of doing that grows to be too much to continue normal life with it. The amount of fantasy is what's out of control, but what happens in it, is in control. That's why it's a good place to escape to, totally safe, even if it's not a happy place.

Flor


Thanks, Flor--that explanation helped me understand the differences a lot better. But I think I still don't quite get the difference between "daydreaming" and building things in the inner world. If you can build things in the inner world, then aren't those under your control?

Or is it that what counts is that the people in the inner world aren't under your control, but in daydreaming they are? So it's not the construction of things in the inner world or in the "daydream" that determines whether it's under your control--it's whether or not you can control what the people do?
TheGangsAllHere
Consumer 6
Consumer 6
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2017 4:15 am
Local time: Thu Dec 03, 2020 5:49 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Can you have DID and MD?

Postby SystemFlo » Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:29 am

TheGangsAllHere wrote:
Thanks, Flor--that explanation helped me understand the differences a lot better. But I think I still don't quite get the difference between "daydreaming" and building things in the inner world. If you can build things in the inner world, then aren't those under your control?

Or is it that what counts is that the people in the inner world aren't under your control, but in daydreaming they are? So it's not the construction of things in the inner world or in the "daydream" that determines whether it's under your control--it's whether or not you can control what the people do?


Let's put it this way: Inner world is subconscious. Even if you can put things in there that weren't there before, those things can still change without you changing them or you can find a new area of the inner world and be just amazed.

Daydream is thoughts. There's nothing you don't think. You can be amazed by your inspiration to imagine new things that hasn't come to your mind before, but that's creativity working for conscious thoughts, rather than you finding something and learning about it as you look at it.

Closer you compare, that much harder it gets to explain it, because thought are affected by subconscious things and subconscious is affected by thoughts. To tell the differences, we'd need someone who'd had DID and healed from it, then MD and healed from it and therefor also experienced healthy. In the end, I don't know. I've never been different than I am now.

What do you think: I'm in rehab. It's not a nice facility, it's certainly not a home, there's not much happening, because you're suppose to think about the reasons why you are there instead of amusing yourself with anything. Therefor you don't have your phone or access to internet etc. In my mind there is this boy, dark haired teenage boy that is hospitalized due to psychiatric reasons and in a facility too. All the time I'm alone I think about the boy and what he does. His room is like the one I am in. Sometimes I imagine being him while lying on the bed, sometimes I can imagine him being in some activity, like art therapy and if there wouldn't be camera in the room I am in, I'd move around the room doing things like the boy does in my mind, in the art therapy of his hospital. Because of the camera surveillance I don't do that. When boy in my mind talks to other people in his hospital, they may something funny and it's hard not to smile or laugh at it. Sometimes he's sad and you can see that from my face. After I am released from the rehab, I don't need that boy anymore to live in controlled surroundings for me anymore, and he disappears.

Was he a part? Was I daydreaming?
Dx DID
main system:
Flor F adult co-host
Sami M 15-26 (age slider) system manager, defender
(Lucas M 17 caretaker)
etc.

subsystem:
Fourteen M 14 co-host, trauma holder, persecutor:
- random M 14
- Jules M 14
- Leon M 4
- etc.
User avatar
SystemFlo
Consumer 6
Consumer 6
 
Posts: 1171
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:50 pm
Local time: Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:49 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Can you have DID and MD?

Postby KitMcDaydream » Sat Oct 17, 2020 9:38 am

SystemFlo wrote:
What do you think: I'm in rehab. It's not a nice facility, it's certainly not a home, there's not much happening, because you're suppose to think about the reasons why you are there instead of amusing yourself with anything. Therefor you don't have your phone or access to internet etc. In my mind there is this boy, dark haired teenage boy that is hospitalized due to psychiatric reasons and in a facility too. All the time I'm alone I think about the boy and what he does. His room is like the one I am in. Sometimes I imagine being him while lying on the bed, sometimes I can imagine him being in some activity, like art therapy and if there wouldn't be camera in the room I am in, I'd move around the room doing things like the boy does in my mind, in the art therapy of his hospital. Because of the camera surveillance I don't do that. When boy in my mind talks to other people in his hospital, they may something funny and it's hard not to smile or laugh at it. Sometimes he's sad and you can see that from my face. After I am released from the rehab, I don't need that boy anymore to live in controlled surroundings for me anymore, and he disappears.

Was he a part? Was I daydreaming?


This is an interesting topic though I got bit lost reading the explanation but I kind of get what you mean.

I highlighted the last sentence in bold cos it was like this for me also on now 3 different occasions caused by confusion around medical issues. The 'alters/persona's' that took over at each time (Deaf Thea, Kit and Maddie as previously described on here) have all kind of disappeared because the situations they were...'created for' (not sure thats they right term) has either disappeared completely, the body has recovered from it or there's currently no contact with people from that time frame.

I also sometimes wonder if I made them up and was it just me acting out a fantasy character but in the real world to avoid a demand eg being 'Deaf Thea' as she signed and didn't speak so avoiding the demand to speak in public. I could only go to college as her with the condition a communicator spoke my words, was it me lost in fantasy or was it a medical need due to the severe level of anxiety (from Autism/selective mutism) been in that situation caused so I was only able to function partially 'shut down'?

Now that pressure is no longer there and 'I' actually have an understanding that some of my hearing difficulties were in fact an auditory processing disorder 'Deaf Thea' is not needed. 'I' no longer identify as someone who is culturally Deaf (ie I identify with BSL as my language and 'Deaf History' as my roots/history)I live rurally and isolated there's no other deaf born people near me for me to socialise with. Only older folk who only speak and don't know sign, a similar community to that I grew up in as an 'hearing child'.

With Maddie (as a wheelchair user) it was different. Wheelchair users don't see themselves as an 'ethnic minority' with their own language and culture (unless they also happened to have been born deaf) but generally they are either regular NT (neurotypical) people who acquired a condition/disability (stroke/accident, MS etc) or were born that way (CP).

This physical body still has some element of mobility issues but they are not generally at the level 'Maddie' was stuck at, unless we're having a really bad day with the arthritis and fatigue. (mainly in freezing conditions - Jan/Feb tends to be worse). But Maddie had also been a big presence on social media and people that knew this body as Maddie still try to message us and want to visit and Maddie has had enough and doesn't want to have to be out front. Letting people think 'Maddie' died caused confusion cos NT think 'this actual physical body died' they don't look at it and see that more than one identity lives within it.

We've struggled with this issue alot in the end 'others' have had to 'pretend to be Maddie' for a couple of hours when people insisted on visiting whilst trying to cut the 'ties' gradually. Lockdown has helped, the body has a legitimate reason for not being able to go out and meet anyone face to face! No-one has to 'pretend to be Maddie' for the rest of this year at least!

In the meantime 'others' within are coming forwards and blossoming! One's that have spent their lives hidden 'inside', are they real? or imagination? They feel very real when they're out here enjoying a walk out with the dog, hearing and seeing real nature in the outside world. They feel very much alive!
User avatar
KitMcDaydream
Consumer 6
Consumer 6
 
Posts: 535
Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2018 1:24 pm
Local time: Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:49 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Previous

Return to Dissociative Identity Disorder Forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 49 guests