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What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

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What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby influence » Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:38 pm

Additionally, although it has been suggested that “successful” psychopaths would be average or high on conscientiousness, because it is associated with better impulse control, secondary psychopathy, especially the lifestyle factor is associated with low conscientiousness, while interpersonal traits are not. Hence, this might suggest that in “successful” psychopaths, at least in terms of criminal success, low conscientiousness is not necessarily a drawback and may actually help them succeed in their chosen endeavours. On the other hand, while high conscientiousness tends to be beneficial in mainstream society, for violent criminals and psychopaths it may actually be unhelpful. Aharoni and Kiehl’s findings are comparable to the results of another study (Morselli & Tremblay, 2004) that found that criminals who scored low in a measure of self-control reported higher earnings from criminal activities. Similar to Aharoni and Kiehl’s finding that psychopathy apparently facilitated success in violent rather than non-violent crimes, Morselli and Tremblay found that low self-control was associated with higher earnings from predatory crimes (e.g., theft, robbery, fraud) rather than “market” crimes (i.e., criminal activities involving consensual transactions, e.g., drug dealing, smuggling, fencing stolen goods, illegal gambling, etc.). Low self-control is essentially equivalent to low conscientiousness, so this provides further evidence that low conscientiousness may actually be adaptive to some extent in criminal contexts, rather than a liability, especially for violent, predatory crimes.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog ... psychopath
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Re: What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby vcrpamphlet » Sun Mar 24, 2019 1:22 am

Hi influence, just wrote a reply, but this forum is apparently too needy to allow posts to be slowly written on a phone, and ka poof, over 500 words gone.

What a f*cking genius tool that is. Really handy. Glad to have been part of it. Will write it again later if I can be f*cked.
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Re: What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby vcrpamphlet » Sun Mar 24, 2019 5:20 am

Cool, so, did it in notepad this time so it wouldn't get lost, and in the magical-on-this-cheap-as-sh*t-phone copy + paste process, managed to somehow slip my fat thumb on the 'a' button. Leaving no post left, just 6 a's. Excellent. Now, did you know (get your trivia hats on) that android phones don't have an undo feature? Terrific!

I don't really know. Whole thing is a cluster f*ck. No-one - psychos included - can get their definition straight - something about them being stubborn - successful ones don't see the problem, failed ones don't see their options - something about Kevin Dutton and algorithms - jomp is apparently successful, so might have an answer for the question of impulse control - something about that being the kicker - aside from impulse control, it's luck-of-the-draw for the individual's uninhibited desire; if they're naturally sadistic or naturally really into football and so on - something about May as well accept Reaper as one, as alternative assumes a more solid scientific foundation than we presently have - Chomsky quote: "psychology is really prescientific" - and something about how Reaper, if she were here, would probably say it's impossible for a psychopath to have the self-control for success because of her own "psychopathic stubbornness" - screw the objectivity - and something about how a psychopath benefited by good environment and lucky natural impulses, who isn't low-IQ, is I'd say highly likely to succeed by most measures, whereas most of the rest seem capable of using the same excuses for their failure up until death.
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Re: What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby vcrpamphlet » Sun Mar 24, 2019 5:34 am

Also something about hybrids of the two types mentioned in that last paren - and whether there might be a few such people signed up here?
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Re: What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby justonemoreperson » Sun Mar 24, 2019 10:44 am

vcrpamphlet wrote:jomp is apparently successful, so might have an answer for the question of impulse control


It's hard to quantify. In some ways I seem to have a handle on it but in other ways I don't. I'd say that I was successful now, but I've not always been so.

Less than 15 years ago I lost £120k due to impulsive stupidity, was left with nothing, had bailiffs knocking on the door and lost my job through reckless incompetence.

I think I need shiny things dangled in front of me to keep my interested.

Getting a new job was exciting, as I had the opportunity to "shine." New people who didn't know me allowed me to be charismatic and charming without them knowing enough about me to see it was all a con.

I nearly lost that job too, because I got to work at home and was far more interested in smoking weed and playing on my Playstation to do any work, but fortunately my boss changed to some wanker in the US who was more incompetent than me and so my ineptitude was eventually lost in the noise of him losing his job.

Then I got involved in an area of work that I found fascinating and it gave me a niche position that set me aside from everyone else: dangly shiny things.

However, as much as I like to think the impulse control is under control, it's not. What's changed in the environment. Now I work for myself but do the same thing as I did before. It's a coin-operated method of work that suits me well: "Can you do that? Yes? Thanks - here have a big bag of cash, now go back and smoke weed and play on your PS4 until I call you again."

No one else does what I do and I do it well, so how I do it is largely overlooked.

I could write a list of stuff that I do through a lack of impulse control; I'm just in an environment where it doesn't present as many issues as it did when I was younger. Also, being married acts like having Jiminy Cricket on your shoulder.

If I were to come up with a formula for success, it would be:

Find something you find interesting that no one else wants to do.
Be charming and liked. People liking you is, beyond doubt, the greatest business skill you can ever have. F*ck hard work and diligence, being someone people like is way more effective.
Be intelligent.
Distract yourself with shiny things.
Hope no one pisses you off where there's CCTV.
I'm not arguing; I'm explaining why I'm right.
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Re: What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby Greebo » Sun Mar 24, 2019 1:41 pm

Completely off topic but I’m surprised that the PlayStation gets a prominent role, my usual relationship with a video game is to play it for 30 mins, get bored and never touch it again.

Often people talk about being under stimulated but the things that appear to hold them seem quite ordinary. Weight lifting being a prominent example, and no offence to those who are into it, but however you cut it, it is still a sport based around the exciting activity of picking things up.

I guess it’s just a case of what people find ‘shiny’.
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Re: What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby vcrpamphlet » Mon Mar 25, 2019 3:34 am

justonemoreperson wrote:Find something you find interesting that no one else wants to do.
Be charming and liked. People liking you is, beyond doubt, the greatest business skill you can ever have. F*ck hard work and diligence, being someone people like is way more effective.
Be intelligent.
Distract yourself with shiny things.
Hope no one pisses you off where there's CCTV.


It's interesting you focus on likeability like that. There's a vague sentiment among neurotypicals that the best way there is to embrace your potential and "be yourself" ... but anyone who's worked in business knows just how effective 'dynamic sincerity' can be, and how ineffective full authenticity can get. People don't give two shits about your true inner feelings; their desire to be around you, is nearly always in exact proportion to however you make them feel.

Speaking as as a borderline-ish narcy bipolar, it's often amazing how similar the less criminal side of psychopathy is to my own experience. Relate completely with the shining in a new role thing, only there's probably a distinction in how I wasn't really aware of the fakery so much, as I imagine a psychopath would be, just that I was "faking it till I made it" - over time, as different adoptions became unconscious, it was less about confidence, more about sincerity and, strangely enough, honesty -

That's something I've been wanting to ask you about actually. What kind of value do you have on honesty (in yourself and other people)? And, are you ever driven by a sense of purpose or duty - do either of those matter in your book?

Greebo wrote:Weight lifting being a prominent example, and no offence to those who are into it, but however you cut it, it is still a sport based around the exciting activity of picking things up.


Go f*ck yourself. Nothing better than watching a bunch of powerlifting videos in your underwear, especially Larry Wheels pulling a new PR each week, or Eddie Hall log pressing 200+kg for reps. Gets you charged for a good training session. It's not about picking things up; it's about being way stronger than you'll ever need to be, for slightly-better-than-arbitrary reasons, because you can, because testosterone is retarded.
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Re: What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby justonemoreperson » Mon Mar 25, 2019 7:32 am

vcrpamphlet wrote:. People don't give two shits about your true inner feelings; their desire to be around you, is nearly always in exact proportion to however you make them feel.


Agreed. Sometimes, there's a fine line between making people feel good and them wanting you to be around (which is valuable, especially if that's your boss) and being a sycophant. No one wants to feel played.


That's something I've been wanting to ask you about actually. What kind of value do you have on honesty (in yourself and other people)?


Depends on who and why. A person who lies to themselves is pathetic, as it demonstrates their weakness.

Everyone lies; the difference is that some lies are acceptable and some are not. It really depends on the motivation behind the lie. Personal lies seem to be more acceptable than situational lies.

Once you try to untangle the whole truth / lie issue beyond the obvious, the more irrelevant it becomes. At the end of the day, what's more important than truth is sincerity. For an example of that, look at anyone who believes in something.

And, are you ever driven by a sense of purpose or duty - do either of those matter in your book?


Not really. I'm motivated to a visible display of purpose and duty, which I guess is not the same. I protect my own, wife / kids etc, as they belong to me and kids are the only real purpose we have as a species. I'm driven by stuff that interests me.
I'm not arguing; I'm explaining why I'm right.
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Re: What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby justonemoreperson » Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:11 am

Something to add about honesty:

We're on an anonymous forum for people who are, by the nature of the condition, liars. And yet, at least once a week the issue of sincerity and honesty is raised by someone as an attack on another, which is then usually defended.

I get more consideration on this forum than many and it's not because I tell graphic stories about violence and eating people's livers with a nice Chianti. It's because I'm consistent.

Consistency people like, because it gives them more reasonable grounds for belief and generates sincerity. Everyone knows that I play with people on here and I'm often directly insulting and rude. And yet, people keep engaging with me because they know that I'm consistent and so the chances of them looking stupid by being gullible are reduced.

No one really cares about honesty, they just don't want to look stupid.
I'm not arguing; I'm explaining why I'm right.
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Re: What Makes a "Successful" Psychopath?

Postby vcrpamphlet » Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:15 am

It's crossed my mind to make a thread about the nature of discussions in this place. For the reasons you mentioned, it's futile to hold members here accountable for their dishonesty, but there's a distinction between trolls and the narcissistically self-righteous *cough*.

Well marshalled couple of posts there jomp. Would argue, while consistency has the effect you describe, there are some unexpected benefits to experiencing differing mental states over time; they're just useless in motion. Better elaborated on in the bipolar forum than here though.

I disagree that your respectability relies on your consistency so much. As much as few here seem to admit it, you're at the very least the closest thing to a primary psychopath we've got; the writing drifts between agreeable pontification and cogent essay and is always highly readable; and in spite of your better efforts to remain mysterious it's still clear to the shrewder browser that underneath it all, psychopath or not, you're probably a good bloke - whatever that means.

Inconsistency of character isn't too much of a problem so long as you don't need them for anything. It's inconsistency of purpose that can get annoying, especially in a place like this; it seems you're fairly topic-stable, and bring little to no emotionality; me on the other hand, sort of like that over-zealous kid in the sandpit that wrecks all the sandcastles showing everyone his big yellow Tonka.

Do you see any value in that hippy principle of moral alignment? That being, when everything you think, say, and do, are perfectly aligned with each other. Without the feelings involved, would that kind of structure be worth experimenting with?
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