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Psychopathy, a different perspective

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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby Solowolfpack » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:16 pm

solemnlysworn wrote:I tried a course of SSRIs for about 6 months. I noticed that it only made me flatter, more dissociated most of the time. It induced a generalised anxiety (bodily sensation), sickness, and issues with sexual performance. I felt tired all the time and my eating was worse.

The idea behind it seems to be to constrict affect so if you're already limited then isn't it a little pointless? It seems as though unless you experience strong/moderate negative affect then it's not going to be effective.

Just my two cents but stims worked better.


Could be you needed a different one, I am flatter emotionally but considering my anger issues and anxiety it’s a decent trade off for me. I was on sertraline at first and that made me dissaociate bad and I couldn’t cum if I fuked for 2 hours and jerked off until my arm dropped dead. It worked fine but couldn’t finish. Now I’m on lexapro and other than being flat, which I already am anyway that’s the only side effect I get.
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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby solemnlysworn » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:19 pm

It's always possible but I dont think I'm depressed.

I think my logic is that I tested for depression to see if I was misattributing ill feeling for flatness. Anhedonia, depression and lack of affect are difficult to differentiate but it doesnt feel like a negative feeling. I'm just maybe not easily aroused which seems like a different issue. I dont have anxiety- only happened when I was on the drugs and even then it was non-specific and just a generalised uncomfortable sensation. Dont have issues with anger either else I'd probably not identify with flat affect
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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby PsychoGenesis » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:21 pm

never used meth but i bet it should feel close to DXM + Bup for someone with primary psychopathy
it let my amygdala tingling for 2-3 nights, thought there was an alien inside of me :lol:

these days i only get effects related to the sigma receptor like better posture, im using generic bupropion now too so there's that...
Last edited by PsychoGenesis on Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby xcagedsilhouttex » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:22 pm

ultimately reach a point of no return, where they feel they have cut through the last thin connection with the normal world


I don't generally enjoy the term psychopathy because it has been applied to a plethora of people with a variety of mental health issues who have behaved violently. Dahmer was PD NOS I believe with Borderline traits. That being said, the above quote and the part about either leading a life superficially and feeling isolated in that life or being who you actually are and driving everyone away is very relatable and the predominant subject matter in my therapy sessions.

In my late teens and early twenties, I was far more social than I am now and it was exhausting and depressing having to put on appearances. I was popular but I felt incredibly lonely. It felt like I was a meat shaped mirror, projecting what everyone else wanted to see but nobody was able to see anything beyond the reflection. I used drugs which started off as stimulants which made me feel less flat and more able to withstand and even enjoy being around others. I am trying to find the exact wording here... When I was younger, I had the want to connect but the inability to achieve it. The euphoria I experienced on stimulants mimicked that connection sensation but when I came down, the connection I felt the previous night ceased and the isolated feeling came back. Interacting with others was like taking part in a play, and the next day the production was over and that character no longer existed.

That reality hit me hard, most notably on an MDMA trip where I had intense paranoia that everyone could see through my cracks. That trip was mortifying and at the time inaccurate but I became so paranoid that keeping up appearances became exhausting and I still had that feeling of utter isolation and underlying fear of showing my real self and the reactions to it.

The compensation for perfect appearances in public life led to a converse acting out in all the areas I was trying to hide during my private time. To the point where my urges and that time started to overtake time that I would have been in others company. The dullness of everyday interactions needed to be compensated with euphoria.

Eventually the side I was trying to mask began to crack and spill out. If I had not been sanctioned at that point, I would have crossed that line. At that point, nothing else really seemed to matter.

I am not sure if this is relatable at all to those with AsPD specifically but it's what I was struck by in the first article link. I haven't read the second one yet.
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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby solemnlysworn » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:24 pm

There are only small pockets of meth around the UK. It's available but, having watched guys on it, the experience never strike me as something to strive towards
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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby Reaper » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:29 pm

Solowolfpack wrote:http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/psychotic-affective-disorders/hidden-suffering-psychopath Pg1.

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/psychotic-affective-disorders/hidden-suffering-psychopath/page/0/1 pg2.

It’s an article I pulled of the Internet, so grain of salt I suppose but I find this interesting because it paints a completely different picture than the general public has and the one that is expressed on this board. Does this resonate with anyone here?


This article has been discussed a number of times on the forum in the past. There are some parts I can definitely relate to, others not so much or not at all. I can't be bothered explaining which parts they are. At least not at the moment anyway.
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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby Solowolfpack » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:34 pm

Flat affect is an inability to express emotions in the face and voice, not an inability to feel them. Psychopaths tend to have a shallow affect which is the same thing as blunted affect in medical terms so it’s a less extreme version. Psychopaths most definitely experience anger, rage and negative emotions.

Complete Apathy is more schizoid or schizophrenic territory imo
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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby solemnlysworn » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:50 pm

I'd assumed most of these are exchangeable. Using your definitions, I can display affect. I just have shallow affect.
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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby PsychoGenesis » Sat Nov 10, 2018 9:58 pm

was skimming a paper when i found this:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12500783/


seems like the brain do encode emotions unconsciously through facial expression mimicry ''automatic somatic reactions''
people lower on empathy do this less

anyone has read Paul Ekman?? it might be useful :lol:

some drugs that modulate emotion perception

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15229059/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16769178/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17955021/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2913325/

-------------------------------

solemnlysworn wrote:I don't know much about the science behind it-- Are you saying that flat affect (rather than negative affect) can be resolved through a long enough course of serotonin treatment? My understanding was it was to regulate so that people feel good more often when they feel bad by default, rather than to stimulate more feeling in general


this may answer your question:

RESULTS:
In the facial expression recognition task, citalopram and reboxetine reduced the identification of the negative facial expressions of anger and fear. Citalopram also abolished the increased startle response found in the context of negative affective images. Both antidepressants increased the relative recall of positive (versus negative) emotional material. These changes in emotional processing occurred in the absence of significant differences in ratings of mood and anxiety. However, reboxetine decreased subjective ratings of hostility and elevated energy.


So it seems to work on the feedback system, not so much to ''feel'' better emotionally :| :(
''our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate
our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure''


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Re: Psychopathy, a different perspective

Postby Solowolfpack » Sat Nov 10, 2018 10:36 pm

xcagedsilhouttex wrote:
ultimately reach a point of no return, where they feel they have cut through the last thin connection with the normal world


I don't generally enjoy the term psychopathy because it has been applied to a plethora of people with a variety of mental health issues who have behaved violently. Dahmer was PD NOS I believe with Borderline traits. That being said, the above quote and the part about either leading a life superficially and feeling isolated in that life or being who you actually are and driving everyone away is very relatable and the predominant subject matter in my therapy sessions.

In my late teens and early twenties, I was far more social than I am now and it was exhausting and depressing having to put on appearances. I was popular but I felt incredibly lonely. It felt like I was a meat shaped mirror, projecting what everyone else wanted to see but nobody was able to see anything beyond the reflection. I used drugs which started off as stimulants which made me feel less flat and more able to withstand and even enjoy being around others. I am trying to find the exact wording here... When I was younger, I had the want to connect but the inability to achieve it. The euphoria I experienced on stimulants mimicked that connection sensation but when I came down, the connection I felt the previous night ceased and the isolated feeling came back. Interacting with others was like taking part in a play, and the next day the production was over and that character no longer existed.

That reality hit me hard, most notably on an MDMA trip where I had intense paranoia that everyone could see through my cracks. That trip was mortifying and at the time inaccurate but I became so paranoid that keeping up appearances became exhausting and I still had that feeling of utter isolation and underlying fear of showing my real self and the reactions to it.

The compensation for perfect appearances in public life led to a converse acting out in all the areas I was trying to hide during my private time. To the point where my urges and that time started to overtake time that I would have been in others company. The dullness of everyday interactions needed to be compensated with euphoria.

Eventually the side I was trying to mask began to crack and spill out. If I had not been sanctioned at that point, I would have crossed that line. At that point, nothing else really seemed to matter.

I am not sure if this is relatable at all to those with AsPD specifically but it's what I was struck by in the first article link. I haven't read the second one yet.


Excellent post, thanks for sharing.
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