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Open Discussions about Self Esteem and Related Issues

Postby Spiggy » Fri Apr 13, 2007 2:12 pm

Being a short man must be difficult, because society seems to expect men to be tall.

But I know two old gentlemen (I mean old, late 70's to early 80's) who are 5'1 and 5'3, who came to terms with being short. They were both in the RAF and were WW2 bomber crew, as you needed to be small to fit into some of the places in the aircraft.

I think that society needs people of all heights, shapes and sizes.

Rejoice in your uniqueness, and there will be things that you can do that taller men can't.
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hey there:)

Postby somebody » Fri Apr 27, 2007 8:20 pm

Hi there,
there is a way to look taller. Get your self a pair of elevator shoes. But honestly, getting the shoes is not the point of having a healthy self esteem. I would personally recommend you to accept your height and see the height for what it is (that is, it makes you less attractive, but that's all) and not buy the shoes. Other than that, an adult does not really grow any taller.
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Re: hey there:)

Postby mullog » Sat Apr 28, 2007 1:03 am

somebody wrote:I would personally recommend you to accept your height and see the height for what it is (that is, it makes you less attractive, but that's all) and not buy the shoes.


In what way does perceiving your height makes you less atractive help having self-esteem?

I'm quite a tall guy and I've found atractive tall and some short women too.
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Postby somebody » Sun Apr 29, 2007 12:22 pm

Well, if he's not satisfied with his height then he hasn't accepted himself. Height actually is something that can't be changed no matter what (well except for the elevator shoes or expensive and time consuming cosmetic surgeries). You, being tall, naturally you don't have to think about being tall or short. Of course it's relavant, you know, how you would define being tall or short, but the point is he has to accept himself for what he is. At his height, I'd say he's short, we won't lie to him.

A major aspect of low or unhealthy self esteem is the struggle towards better us in comparison to other people. While a person with a healthy self esteem competes only against him/herself.

So, those that keep living in this self defeating world of trying to be equal or super pass others (that's what people with low self esteem do), they will never succeed, before always someone will have it better in some aspect. But even they do succeed and be the best of the best, which should be really hard, still height doesn't change.


When it comes to attractiveness, mass media have made quite a lot of damage here, trying to define what's beauty for men and what's beauty for women to sell more products damaging the idea of what looks good and not, and many people fall victims to this.

Let's not try to speak here, about what subjectively is considered to be beauty, but don't trust what mass media is selling you, because it's not real. It's heavily changed with make up, lights and Photoshop. Being tall is also one of these elements that mass media are trying to promote.

Women believe taller men are more successful in many aspects of life. What they see there, even if they don't know, it's men with more self esteem.

Again, it goes the other way around. Men came to believe that women should look like mass media say, but that's another story; we'll definetely talk about it some time later.

For men a woman's height does not matter. In fact, men usually prefer shorter women than they are, it makes them feel more masculine or they like paidomorfic feaures (make women look younger).

So, what's true here, is that taller men appear to have more self esteem (of course many don't, still women and other people think they have) and that's the quality women like, self esteem and that's a good thing that people should aim for, self esteem, regardless if they are women or men.

Talking about height, most women though are content if men are at least at the same height as they are, so if you consider yourself short, well it doesn't matter if you are short or tall.

So, if you think height for what it really is, rather than some super natural weird quality that women for some reason seem to like, then all it remains is attractiveness, but that also may not held true after all, I haven't found enough evidence yet to tell you for sure. If you are taller than average, you have already won the first impressions to the eyes of women, so consider that a gift of luck, but height alone means nothing.
Last edited by somebody on Fri May 18, 2007 9:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby puma » Sun Apr 29, 2007 2:06 pm

One solution for a person who feels vertically challenged is to move to a foreign country where everyone is small. I am 5 ft 3 and 123 pounds, on the small side in America, but when I went to Japan I was taller than most of the people. I really enjoyed being at eye level with the majority.
I have some Philipino in-laws, and next to these petit ladies I feel like a big moose! Even in Mexico I feel taller, as most Mexicans are shorter than those of Northern European or African descent.
This height thing is all relative. My best friend always has plenty of girl friends, and he is 5 ft 6. He radiates happiness and good cheer. That is what the ladies find attractive about him.
Short men we like: Dudley Moore, Danny De Vito, Elton John. Some others:
155 cm (5 ft 1 in)
John Keats — poet
Genghis Khan — Mongol Emperor
Ian McCartney — politician
Victor Emmanuel III of Italy — king
Giuseppe Zangara — criminal
Norbert Wiener — mathematician
Dan Spitz — guitarist
Seth Green — actor
Timothy Vincken — Dutch Footballer
So its not how far your head is from the ground, its what is in it.
"So It Goes..." Kurt Vonnegut
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Postby somebody » Sun Apr 29, 2007 7:42 pm

I agree, he has to understand that height is not an issue. It's neither good or bad to be either tall or short, it's something absolutely neutral. Althought I agree that it would make your life easier if you were a lot more taller than average (as other things do, like a priveleged childhood, beauty, talent, intelligence, etc), but only superficially. Why superficially? Well, it can give you more dates for instance. But being tall is not a substitute for being prepared to put effort in a relationship for instance, it's not a substitute for a college degree, it's not a substitute for working hard etc. It's only good at winning some of the first impressions.

And free yourself of the fears of physical attacks. We live in a civilised world. Be smart enough to avoid trouble.

Start loving yourself for what you are, then you'll get all the confidence in the world (healthy self esteem by the way is 4 things together: self confidence, that grows from self acceptance, a positive self image, self faith or persistence, being free from fears of success or failure).
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Postby somebody » Sat May 05, 2007 5:30 pm

Another factor when it comes to women and height is some primitive insticts women have. Women tend to feel more secure with taller men, because they assume that being tall means they are protected.

Again, most women are satisfied to be with a man, at least their own height, but being tall and feeling protected for women is probably a reality.

Height only really mattered back in hunting days. Later on, in more civilised days, skillful and rich people was what mattered (back then though, people were really short and died by age 30, so it was really a very different life).

Of course it's really sad if you think about it. In a civilised world, like most countries are, real danger lies within the people you are spending most time with. So, for a woman, that person would be her boyfriend or her husband.

Real danger lies with the person that a women is with. Unfortunate truth is that half of men are no good. The rest are all right to good.

No danger within a shopping mall or a cafeteria, so that a woman's man can protect her. Of course danger might be there for you if you are a person that enjoys night more than day and hangs around with mysterious persons, night clubs a lot etc.

Again, I'll say it one more time. The people close to you, the ones that you have at your home or at work, if no good, they can be dangerous. Not everybody else. Everybody else, no matter how good or bad, the ones that you meat in everyday societal places, they are bound by the rules of society, because they have no choice to be dangerous.

In our modern world, many women that think like that, correlating protection to height of their male partners are likely to be insecure and tend to want being submissive. These women are likely to prefer a fat, tall man with no much record when it comes to education, of average to lower intelligence, and with an average job over a good looking, muscular, educated, smart, carreer driven, but shorter individual. Does that make sense? No. But it's true and it's sad.

What's even sadder is that evolutiary speaking, tall men do not seem to be the better than shorter men, quite the contrary really (just like lighter skin or eyes are more prone to sun damage). Shorter but muscular men are quite strong really, their physique allows for stronger muscles, they are less prone to damage to their muscles and skeleton and they have better endurance and flexibility. They even live longer (because less stress is placed on their heart), for instance the people in Japan that are quite short for worldwide standards, live the longest.

Women prefer taller men because of societal standards.

And what's even more sad is that shorter men are more loyal and their relationships last longer. That is that many women eventually understand and they go for the tall males for adventures, but for longer term commitments they go for the shorter men.

Why taller men are less loyal? Well, they are naturally more attractive to women, so, you get the point. They have more choices. They invest on short term relationships, but not on longer term relationships (again, this is not the rule, if you want a better rule avoid very tall males).

So, if you are short. Well, luck played you a bad joke and decided that you will be less liked by women for really ridiculous reasons. You may also were more prone to bullies misbehaviour during high school (that may have damaged your self esteem and you now need to fix it).

If you are tall, you get more women, but being tall means nothing to your success in life, apart for the fact that you may have self esteem, without actually having to put more effort than your shorter cousins to get it.

Even self esteem really itself, while very good to have it (and I strongly suggest it) and certainly it helps and it makes you happy and other goodies, like you have self confidence, it is not really very important for a successful life. It basically make you happy and can make you earn like 600 dollars more a year.

When it comes to carreer advancement, education first, working experience second and finally self esteem are the factors that contribute to how successful you will be (but not being tall).

If you are a woman with self esteem issues, that thinks of her self as an inferior person, prone to physical attacks and of little worth to do something important in her life, please work on your self esteem, learn to love your self and refuse to be submissive.

While I am not saying that short men are better than tall men or the opposite, because I just stated facts, I am telling you to judge people by their personalities and by things you can actually witness, rather than weirdo stereotypes (like, wow, he's tall, so he's good! God, no, don't do that.). If you see they are no good, never say, they will change (because they won't, they may change if they want to, but it's not very likely), but keep them away or walk away (whatever applies).
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Postby Lucidor » Fri May 11, 2007 12:46 pm

I just saw a quote that immediately made me think of PSELLISMOPHILIA:

It's better to have loved a short man than to never have loved a tall
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Postby somebody » Mon May 14, 2007 7:28 pm

That's sad way of thinking.
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Postby somebody » Mon May 14, 2007 7:30 pm

Probably some girl's thinking that lives in "illusions". I wouldn't pay any attention except that I may feel sorry for her.
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