ADHD/ODD without violent and aggressive behaviors

Hello everyone, here is my situation.

My son Tyler is almost 7 years old. He was diagnosed ADHD and put on Adderall. It was like night and day for most of the rest of the kindergarten school year until he reached maximum dosage of 20mg/day. I gave him a little break from the meds over the summer because his tollerance to it was growing and I don't even want to get into his eating problem. He had no appetite and would not eat anything, and I feel was being malnourished, but I did my best because the school encouraged better behavior.

Here we come to first grade. I will try to keep this short. He has been diagnosed with ADHD and ODD. He is very hyper and fidgety, can not stop to concentrate on things he is not interested in, but will for things he likes. He is NOT aggressive, violent or mean, but he is annoying. He will poke kids and do little things to get their attention, he does not know his boundries and when to stop. He is very much a loner and gets bullied a lot, so he is withdrawn and believes no one likes him because of the isolation from his classmates from his first grade teacher who stuck his desk in the corner by her desk, far away from all the other kids for most of the school year. He is the most defiant child I have ever seen but it is like he just will not do it. He doesn't react in an explosive way like some of the diagnosis information says. It is like a child you see walking down the street and just drops, refusing to walk. And no matter what you do, he isn't going nowhere. But he doesn't throw fits or tantrums, he isn't destructive and he doesn't torture animals or anything like that. He will just cross his arms, say no and just not do what you want him to.

My fear is that he will become like more violent and aggressive. I can see it happening and I want to nip it in the bud. I am very strict, rather structured and consistant with him. He will manipulate others and is darn good at it. I do not put up with that. But on the other hand, I do pick my battles and me and everyone else have run out of ideas on how to deal with him. None of know what to do with him or for him. We have tried many techniques and used behavior modifications. Nothing is helping!!

Now it sounds like this kid is absolutely horrible. I have seen many accomplishments and improvements in the last 2 years. That is the thing, he is very polite saying please and thank you, he is so bright and smart and creative, he does follow regular rules of the house like certain chores and certain behaviors when we are about, he complies. But when he gets it in his head he doesn't want to do anything, boy he won't! He'll say no, sit there and just have the blankest stare, he will see right thru you. I try to focus on the positive in him and compliment and recognize good behavior. Does no good....

It breaks my heart to know that nobody really likes him just because he is so annoying. He has one friend, our neighbor, and that kid is a horrible influence on him, so I limit his time a lot. But he is the only kid that will play with him. No one else wants to befriend him and even other adults have acted like they don't want me around with him. It is hard to explain, but he is just an annoying little brat, but in a non-violent, decietful way.

Any advice would sure be helpful to me and be very much apprecaited. I am glad I found this forum.

I can relate to your assessment of my son. My son has friends, but they're the ones that can influence him into misbehaving. We're currently seeking psych. help and considering medication before he starts 1st grade. I understand your pain!! My husband and I are trying to deal with this and accept it.

Us and his K teacher filled out behavior forms on him this past winter. The psychologist said he was in the clinical range for ODD.
That was scary. We're exploring the possiblity of ADHD too.

Anyway, just wanted to say I understand. We've done a lot by way of discipline in the last 3 years but with little success in long term behavior control.

It's hard. I know!!

It sounds like a very frustrating experience for you. I do not envy you during parent teacher conferences.

Since you sound like you have all the appropriate parenting techniques and are applying them on a consistent basis considering no parent can be consistant 100% of the time. I would reflect on what happened to him on an emotional level when he starting first grade. From your post and concerns about boundary issues, it sounds like that he is needing additional support in the area of social skills development. This tends to be a common factor in individuals with ADHD. Other factors that may be contributing to his behavior could be an underlying learning disability and/or his response to the bullying at school. Kids that experience either or both issues can display defiant behaviors since they have not yet developed the emotional maturity at his age to deal with these issues in an appropriate manner. Individual counseling outside of the school setting may be helpful with him in dealing with these issues. Lastly, he could be just going through a normal but annoying growth phase and trying to become more independant from his parents while testing limits and rules placed upon him

Personally, I do not think that the Adderall break or his dosage have anything to do with the current problem. However, you may want to discuss this with his doctor if you feel this is a contributing factor or on-going concern. Also, if you are concerned about malnuturition, place him on a good multi-vitaim.

I belive you should focus on making your childs childhood a safe and secure one... Make sure he feels secure and loved. IF not youll probably end up making another psychopath

ADHD and ODD/conduct disorder, the way i see it, are warningsigns that your kid might develop a psychopathic mind when he reaches adult hood..

Good luck!

Carcharias- I can't agree more with you on the importance of giving children with ODD/ADHD an accepting, encouraging, supportive, and safe enviornment where they can grow and overcome their difficulties however I really feel led to say that it's not too common for children with ODD/ADHD to develop psychopathic behavior later in life. No doubt it does happen enspecially when the defiance is really an attachment disorder a reaction to very early trauma (before age 2) leading to intence internal feelings of insecurity, inability to form genuine relationships, and a strong need to keep control of all situations however even for these children with love, care, support, and proper theriputic intervention this is not likely.

The key is to make sure that the child....
A. Is given a safe enviornment where they are able to recognize a common "good" and feel that those around them are working towards this.
B. Is shown that he/she is a "good" person who is capable of working towards this common good.
C. Is able to develop genuine relationships with those around him/her and is accepted difficulties and all.
D. Is given opportunities to work towards this common "good"
E. Is allowed to effectivly express his/her emotions and taught that having emotions is ok and that feeling one way or another is not wrong or right
F. Is shown that everyone makes mistakes and making a mistake does not make him "bad"
G. Is nurtured in his/her natural curiousities and need to learn to give a lifetime love of learning

Without even just one of these a child will struggle. It sounds like Magestic's child is at risk. He is having difficulty forming friendships with other childrenn and it's very likely he sees himself as a "bad" kid. When a child has ADHD or any other behavioral/mental illness it is likely that they hear these insults over and over (your bad, stupid, weird) and well they believe them. Positive encouragment takes time...sometimes even years before you can see a responce because often the child is so firm in the belief that they are bad that they don't believe in their good qualities.

When encouraging your son please be very specific. Compliments such as "good" "fantastic" or "excellent" have their place BUT seem very generic and often don't apear genuine. Instead give praise in a more authentic praise using phrases such as "You really have a knack for drawing" or "That was super kind of you to listen to your friend earlier." Even small steps in social skills should be praised and encouraged-remember children with ADHD lack much of the internal motivation most children have making this even more essential for them.

Make it clear that you are never displeased with your son just his behavior and that he is NOT a bad kid. You would be surprised how many children with ADHD believe that they are bad and therefore not capable. Avoid calling your child names like stupid at all cost. Instead critize his choices so that he knows that when he shows "bad" behavior he is capable of changing it and that it is not him that is bad.

Your child also needs some opportunities to develop positive relationships. This may seem impossible because of his struggles but it is so incredibly important. Social skills groups facilitate these sort of chances to kids who have difficulties with this and can also help to supplement many of the social skills your son may be lacking. In general they are inexpencive and often offered by community mental health centers, schools, hospitals, or even YMCAs. Ask around and see if you can find a class for your son.

It can also make a world of difference to allow your child to pick up a productive hobby like an art, gardening, or a sport. Not only can this make a difference is his self-esteem but it can also help to redirect his energies towards something positive. Make sure that when he becomes angry or whatnot that you tell him that it's fine. Everyone becomes angry and shows other emotion but he has the choice of what he does with his emotions and that some choices are more effective than others.

I know it's hard but your on the right track. Keep going and no matter what don't let anyone tell you that you your efforts are in vain. It takes time but can be the most rewarding experience to help your son.
~Jen

oh, crap. its a wonder how many people were diagnosed with ODD and ADD or ADHD that really have aspergers syndrome. this sounds like one of those cases (yes, psychologists <or whoever diagnoses people> can make mistakes! and its not rare for people with AS to get misdiagnosed with ODD. I was getting kinda worried as soon as i read the title ADHD/ODD without violent and aggressive behavior. Even more when you said that the aggressive behavior was something that was stated was supposed to happen usually. and even more when you made your "sidewalk" comment (thats what im calling it).

I feel like I just revisited my childhood.

He is the most defiant child I have ever seen but it is like he just will not do it. He doesn't react in an explosive way like some of the diagnosis information says. It is like a child you see walking down the street and just drops, refusing to walk. And no matter what you do, he isn't going nowhere. But he doesn't throw fits or tantrums, he isn't destructive and he doesn't torture animals or anything like that. He will just cross his arms, say no and just not do what you want him to.

He feels safe by ignoring you and the real world. It makes him feel in control to disallow you the ability to control his actions. I remember when I had tantrums like this. My parents usually got very annoyed and gave in after so long, which caused me to continue to use that behavior to get my way.

Fortunately, my pathology has evolved since then and I am a highly functioning psychopath. (Or at least I like to believe I am.) Currently, since this was posted 5 years ago, that'd make Tyler 12 right now. I wonder how he's doing. . .

Oh well, the world may never know. It was nice looking back into my childhood, though.