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Art and PDs

Postby Shanzik » Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:44 pm

I think most of my favorite artists, musicians and writers have a PD - Nabokov, Bob Dylan, Kerouac and his whole beatniks gang, Blixa Bargeld, Trent Reznor, etc.

I also belong to artistic social circle and there's a significant number of pwPDs there compared to other social circles.
Has anyone else noticed this?
What is it about art that's attracting pwPDs? What is the connection between the two? Is there a connection between talent and PD?
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Re: Art and PDs

Postby Akuma » Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:27 am

Shanzik wrote:I think most of my favorite artists, musicians and writers have a PD - Nabokov, Bob Dylan, Kerouac and his whole beatniks gang, Blixa Bargeld, Trent Reznor, etc.


Everyone that you idealize has to be soiled in a way.
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Re: Art and PDs

Postby Shanzik » Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:12 pm

Akuma wrote:
Shanzik wrote:I think most of my favorite artists, musicians and writers have a PD - Nabokov, Bob Dylan, Kerouac and his whole beatniks gang, Blixa Bargeld, Trent Reznor, etc.


Everyone that you idealize has to be soiled in a way.




Are you saying they might not really be as dark as I think they are and have a PD, and I'm only seeing what I wanna see in them, or are you saying their existing PDs and darkness is what attracted me to their art in the first place?

You're off-topic, btw. This (for once) was not a topic about me.
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Re: Art and PDs

Postby Midwinter » Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:21 pm

It's because most people with a PD experience some sort of altered world view in a sense. We are better artists because we can write about all of these day to day ordinary things, in a completely extraordinary complex way.

I am a poet, and I can write about a lot when I feel pain as an example. I just think PDs use art as a way to vent.
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Re: Art and PDs

Postby Shanzik » Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:39 pm

Midwinter wrote:It's because most people with a PD experience some sort of altered world view in a sense. We are better artists because we can write about all of these day to day ordinary things, in a completely extraordinary complex way.

I am a poet, and I can write about a lot when I feel pain as an example. I just think PDs use art as a way to vent.


Yes, this is exactly what I noticed about artists around me. I don't think there's a single talented person in my surrounding that doesn't have some kind of a personality disorder, I don't think any of them are a non. They do have specific genres and themes, though, it's almost never a comedy, mostly it's something dark, twisted, sad, about death, inner hell, unrequited love, etc.
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Re: Art and PDs

Postby Akuma » Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:49 pm

Shanzik wrote:
Akuma wrote:
Shanzik wrote:I think most of my favorite artists, musicians and writers have a PD - Nabokov, Bob Dylan, Kerouac and his whole beatniks gang, Blixa Bargeld, Trent Reznor, etc.


Are you saying they might not really be as dark as I think they are and have a PD, and I'm only seeing what I wanna see in them, or are you saying their existing PDs and darkness is what attracted me to their art in the first place?


A personality disorder is a pretty deep, pervasive thing. You can hardly have a personality disorder and be an artist like Reznor or Dylan. Theres a lot of reasons, many of which have been explained in lots of topics here in the past. There is something called Aquired Situational Narcissism though that can amplify existing narcissistic traits in certain situations for celebrities who are almost constantly in the spotlight, but thats not NPD or any PD for that matter.
Aside from that, you neither have the psychological expertise, nor did you have the chance to meet and interview these people in person; frankly diagnosing people you dont kno with personality disorders is not a normal thought process. So I was wondering how you jumped to that conclusion; also in light of your past idealization/devalue cycles. So what came to mind was that you need to unconsciously find something to soil what you idealize.
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Re: Art and PDs

Postby Shanzik » Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:37 pm

Akuma wrote:A personality disorder is a pretty deep, pervasive thing. You can hardly have a personality disorder and be an artist like Reznor or Dylan. Theres a lot of reasons, many of which have been explained in lots of topics here in the past. There is something called Aquired Situational Narcissism though that can amplify existing narcissistic traits in certain situations for celebrities who are almost constantly in the spotlight, but thats not NPD or any PD for that matter.
Aside from that, you neither have the psychological expertise, nor did you have the chance to meet and interview these people in person; frankly diagnosing people you dont kno with personality disorders is not a normal thought process. So I was wondering how you jumped to that conclusion; also in light of your past idealization/devalue cycles. So what came to mind was that you need to unconsciously find something to soil what you idealize.



For god's sake. You're really determined to persuade me I "don't have a normal thought process". I really think I only have a moderate PTSD from my narcissistic ex, and that is all.


All Reznor's lyrics are CLEARLY about his NPD, it can't be any more obvious.
https://genius.com/albums/Nine-inch-nai ... ard-spiral
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Re: Art and PDs

Postby julllia » Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:01 pm

i chose artists with ###$ up lyrics or dark themes not on purpose.and actually they do not change me because i admire them ,but i admire them because i relate.this says something about me more and not about them. at one point i wondered why all songs lyrics seem disordered too to be honest but i think is just me maybe.i doubt someone disordered can hold it together very well .how do they do it?
i do enjoy happy songs but the ones that move me emotionally and are important are darker .
you can also change the meaning.maybe the artist was thinking something else and you interpret it differently.
how about pop artists probably are not.
i also think celebrities are narcissistic but not pathologically.their job makes them have more traits.
i think also pain in lyrics has more artistic value
than when everything is fine.you have something to say and touch deeper people.so artists go deeper if they have talent and explore deeper issues.
weird but my dad wrote poetry to my mom too.when they were young.how the ###$ narcissists are emotional but they are not.was always a mind ###$ to me that i can’t solve.
i mean that is what makes you believe they are not narcissists.they are all words but no actions.
they are idealists in words and not in actions are the opposite.
my dad.my aunt was superficial as ###$.
i am sure i find artists with disorders too. this is why i suspect i have something sometimes.like when you are attracted to specific people and you start wondering why everyone i like is ###$ up.
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Re: Art and PDs

Postby julllia » Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:20 pm

also i often think nons and pd feel the same.nons do have same issues but not in a pathological way.
often is hard to see what is different between a non. and a pd.except the self destruction everything else seems so logical
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Re: Art and PDs

Postby Quoth » Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:24 pm

I tend to agree with Akuma on this one.

I would also say that the unempathic nature of NPD and in particular AsPD mean that these PDs will be counterproductive to artistic creativity. They will also likely be incapable of objectively assessing their own work. Criticism will obviously be an issue for the NPDs.

I don't know how BPD and SPD would effect creativity though they would certainly effect the individuals ability to manage their career as an artist.
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