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mind game, actors and "intimacy"

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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby freyja » Mon Oct 13, 2014 4:36 am

That's fascinating unique. I didn't appreciate that at all. So all those many thousand websites on the stages of psychopathic bond including devalue and discard are pure BS?
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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby Unique Username » Mon Oct 13, 2014 4:48 am

freyja wrote:So all those many thousand websites on the stages of psychopathic bond including devalue and discard are pure BS?


Relax. Did i say that?

You asked me about idealization, and i said psychopaths do not do this.

Of course psychopaths can devalue and discard people.. they do it all the time. A lot of the time just for fun and to get reactions from people.

But like esquire said.. for the psychopaths it is not about them. It is about hurting someone else. For a narcissist, devaluing is a direct reaction to how they feel about themselves.
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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby freyja » Mon Oct 13, 2014 4:56 am

With a psychopath, no devaluation is needed since the object has always been entirely separate from them and has little to do with their ego.


I was referring to this. Thanks for your clarification.

Actually, if you type into google the words psychopath and idealize you will find a gazzillion web sites that talk about psychopaths doing that. So I guess you are saying all those websites are wrong in that respect.
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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby Unique Username » Mon Oct 13, 2014 5:17 am

Doesn't everyone idealize people to some degree?

The difference is, narcissists do it subconsciously to support their ego, while psychopaths consciously do it to manipulate you and gain your trust.
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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby freyja » Mon Oct 13, 2014 5:27 am

Thanks unique,
In this short interchanged I've gotten more clarity than I have in a long while...
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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby freyja » Mon Oct 13, 2014 6:23 am

Are some narcissists sadistic? I"m not talking about acting in a hurtful way, but getting pleasure from seeing other people suffer as a result of one's actions. It looks from what is written, that since all feelings revolve back to the self, in narcissism, that narcissists by definition cannot be sadistic. Perhaps that is an oversimplification.
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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby GettingAdvice » Mon Oct 13, 2014 8:14 am

Let's say they are into schadenfreude!!
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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby Unique Username » Mon Oct 13, 2014 2:33 pm

freyja wrote:Are some narcissists sadistic? I"m not talking about acting in a hurtful way, but getting pleasure from seeing other people suffer as a result of one's actions. It looks from what is written, that since all feelings revolve back to the self, in narcissism, that narcissists by definition cannot be sadistic. Perhaps that is an oversimplification.


Actually, narcissists tend to be pretty self critical and do have some inner voices, most of the time voices from their parents, which are in fact sadistic to themselves.

It depends on the person, as does everything, but narcissists can definitely be sadistic. I know for a fact that I am fairly sadistic.
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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby freyja » Tue Oct 14, 2014 3:24 pm

GettingAdvise:

Let's say they are into schadenfreude!!

lol. Can you elaborate on that?

Unique Username:
Actually, narcissists tend to be pretty self critical and do have some inner voices, most of the time voices from their parents, which are in fact sadistic to themselves.

It depends on the person, as does everything, but narcissists can definitely be sadistic. I know for a fact that I am fairly sadistic.


I find this rather opaque. If narcissists as you write devalue others because of how they feel about themselves, since it all goes back to the self -- in what sense can a narcissist be sadistic? I am not saying that I disagree with what you write but rather do not understand it.

Also what about the flip side of sadism -- let's call it enjoying the experience of seeing the other person feel good rather than feel hurt. If a narcissist is capable of being sadistic, is it not the case that a narcissist is capable of caring about another person, and how they feel. There has to be some kind of open channel there -- no?

I am still on the question I asked before which references to what Esquire wrote at the beginning of this thread:

t's quite a connundrum for me how a narcissist can want 'some level of intimacy' and yet not care about how anyone else feels. Have I got that right?
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Re: mind game, actors and "intimacy"

Postby InSpiritus » Tue Oct 14, 2014 3:41 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKddbyumP24

Some very interesting info, even those that dislike Vaknin, he makes a lot of sense.
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