Narc boyfriend? Please help!

Livinginmyhead wrote:There's now an entire post on my blog regarding this... My goal was to tie in scientifically derived diagnostic criteria and then align my own personal experiences beneath each one. The focus is on the Fragile type though, since this is the only point of view from which I can speak honestly.

Livinginmyhead, if my suspicion that my boyfriend has narcissistic tendencies or NPD is correct, it seems (based on what I read about the subtypes) that he falls under the covert/fragile category, so your post was really helpful. Thank you!

Right now I am struggling to understand the traits regarding grandiosity/exaggerated self-importance and lack of empathy and interest in others. I will share a few examples with the intention to see if my observations of my boyfriend’s (let’s call him “Matt”) behaviour can be linked to these specific traits and how they manifest.

Matt was rarely the one who boasted or gladly talked about himself. He was verbally limited and if I wanted to know something I almost had to pull the words out of his mouth. He mostly disliked discussing his past, regardless of which aspect it concerned. Whenever he did tell about himself, it’d be short and poor in details, why a conversation between us about his life often felt like an interview. He also showed very little interest in me, almost never asked anything about my past or present. Even when he visited my family for the first time, he didn't ask them one single question but only answered theirs. When I voluntarily told about myself, I’d almost never get any follow-up questions. However, we could sometimes talk long and deeply about things that interested him, but that weren't directly related to his personal life, random things such as art, politics, etc.. If he had initiated the conversation, we’d talk and talk until he’d stop but if I did, the topic would be discussed only superficially and abruptly. No matter how much it used to hurt me that he didn't seem to care much about me, I loved listening to him (even though the topic perhaps didn't interest me). Is this how narcissistic “grandiosity/exaggerated self-importance/lack of interest in others” may manifest itself?

With regards to “lack of empathy”: he was loving, but in some cases (where one would normally expect the other to react in an empathetic way) he’d be cold, distant and repulsive. I remember one occasion where I had had a tough day and was on my way to see him. As he opened the door I felt such a relief to have him there that I just hugged him and break down in tears, but he didn't try to comfort me or ask why I was crying/what was wrong. As we sat on the couch, I leaned against his chest and hugged him tight and just couldn't stop crying (more so, because he didn't bother), but he was so stiff and just looked out through the window. When I looked up at him I’d find him ogling at me in a rather uncomfortable way and I felt painfully rejected.

A similar situation was when I got to know that a friend of mine had suddenly passed away and Matt and I were writing over the phone. I was so shocked by my friend’s hasty death that I temporarily just couldn't answer him extensively and to my surprise Matt, too, stopped writing. Instead of offering his condolences (I found out about my friend’s passing through him), saying he’s there if I needed to talk or even call me to see how I was doing, he became quiet. I tried to initiate a conversation with him anyway despite the fact that I was feeling terrible and asked what he was doing. He then answered that he was reading (that’s generally the most common answer I’d get from him). This broke my heart in a million pieces.

I don’t know whether he did this because he felt that I was suddenly focusing on someone other than him (grandiosity/exaggerated self-importance?) or if he just didn't care/felt that he shouldn't care (lack of empathy?) or if he avoided to react in order not to appear weak in situations that demanded of him to show his feelings (grandiosity?) or because such feelings were associated with feelings linked to his own trauma and he just didn't know how to handle them? (I read that somewhere).

Either way, it was very hurtful yet I couldn't get angry. I’d feel very disappointed, hurt, violated and rejected, but never angry because I always felt that he wasn't doing what he did on purpose but that something in him prompted him to be like that. Even today – despite of everything – I'm not angry. Heartbroken beyond words, yet understanding and sympathetic. I don’t know…

Miriam,

Just a brief reply. There are a number of PDs and nonPD conditions tacked to a lack of empathy. The defining feature of NPD is:

Narcissistic Personality Disorder is characterized by a long-standing pattern of grandiosity (either in fantasy or actual behavior), an overwhelming need for admiration, and usually a complete lack of empathy toward others.

From what you write he is not grandiose or have an overwhelming need for admiration. It looks more like avoidant to me. check out the wikipedia site on avoidant personality disorder.

In short, if he is not grandiose he does not have NPD as far as I can tell.

Freyja,

Even though, outside of our relationship (I forgot to mention this above), he is very socially active, has lots of friends and a wide social network, has no obvious difficulties in making new friends/approaching people in general/participating in new and socially challenging activities?

He is indeed shy and has said so himself at some point but in certain situations (such as job interviews/business dinners/big cultural events, etc.) he'd shine with self-confidence, knowledge and communication skills.

Confusing...

It is less than a month since he stopped talking to me and today it was confirmed to me that he is indeed cheating with the woman I suspected. I have now written an e-mail to his sister in which I have explained our whole story since it first began 5 years ago (she doesn't even know I exist). I've also written an e-mail to the "other woman", but I have not sent any of them yet. I even might or might not write to him as well. Is that a good/bad idea?

I'm confused about whether or not I should send those messages. I don't want him back any more. I did until today, but I cannot forgive or forget infidelity. He's been going back and forth between me and her for the last few years and I cannot live with that ever again. All of my suspicions are confirmed now, and I don't want revenge. I am not angry or bitter, but very sad and broken because nobody knows about me and what he has done (with my permission as a codep, of course). I feel like I'm shouting in the dark, and it's suffocating me. Now I understand why he would never tell his family about me, why everything was a secret. That way it was easier for him to do what he wanted without anyone questioning his behaviour. And I need them to know.

All I want is justice. I've read that exposing is an important but complicated process that might even backfire because his enablers won't believe me. Any advice on how I should approach them?

***

Miriam please don't send them yet. Take a deep breath. Please do not send as you may regret it in the future. I cannot offer you any advice because I'm dealing with my own stuff right now but I offer you a big hug dear.

fretless mayhem1 wrote:Miriam please don't send them yet. Take a deep breath. Please do not send as you may regret it in the future. I cannot offer you any advice because I'm dealing with my own stuff right now but I offer you a big hug dear.

fretless mayhem1,

Thank you for your reply! You see, I've been silent about this for almost five years now. Never questioned, complained or confronted. And this is partly why I'm here, now. Will I never regret my silence? Why may I regret it if I speak up? Did you have a similar experience?

I am sorry to know you, too, are having a hard time and hope you will find the courage and strength to rise above it. A hug to you!

Miriam,

Looks like you have a much simpler and to-the-point explanation for his behavior to you than possible NPD. He has been abusing you emotionally including by having an affair with another woman for all these years. I found the book Inspiritus recommended on a different thread: "Why does he do that: Inside the Minds of Angry and controlling men" enlightening at cutting out all the crap in how people tend to look at these kinds of situations.

There are lots of reasons not to send those emails. One being that the level of revenge some people are capable of can be surprising. There's a thread by Celia on this topic here too. Writing letters after you have just found out in any case seems like a bad idea to me. Put that on the backburner. No need to act now. None of that is going to solve your own issues -- which is how to get on with your own life. You have been hurt and need to heal.

KEY POINTS TO REMEMBER

1. An abusive man’s emotional problems do not cause his abusiveness. You can’t change him by figuring out what is bothering him, helping him feel better, or improving the dynamics of your relationship.

2.Feelings do not govern abusive or controlling behavior; beliefs, values, and habits are the driving forces.

3.The reasons that an abusive man gives for his behavior are simply excuses. There is no way to overcome a problem with abusiveness by focusing on tangents such as self-esteem, conflict resolution, anger management, or impulse control. Abusiveness is resolved by dealing with abusiveness.

4. Abusers thrive on creating confusion, including confusion about the abuse itself.

5. There is nothing wrong with you. Your partner’s abuse problem is his own

freyja wrote:Looks like you have a much simpler and to-the-point explanation for his behavior to you than possible NPD. He has been abusing you emotionally including by having an affair with another woman for all these years. I found the book Inspiritus recommended on a different thread: "Why does he do that: Inside the Minds of Angry and controlling men" enlightening at cutting out all the crap in how people tend to look at these kinds of situations.

Thanks for the book recommendation. Will search for it. I just ordered Women who love too much by Robin Norwood, which I think may provide some insight into my way of being and why I've been putting up with this for so long (silly me!). Ever heard of/read it? (This is for another thread, I guess, but..)

freyja wrote:There are lots of reasons not to send those emails. One being that the level of revenge some people are capable of can be surprising. There's a thread by Celia on this topic here too. Writing letters after you have just found out in any case seems like a bad idea to me. Put that on the backburner. No need to act now. None of that is going to solve your own issues -- which is how to get on with your own life. You have been hurt and need to heal.

Good point! The main reason why I haven't sent them yet is because it's very much unlike me to "revenge". It's just the violation and the shame that is so hard to bear. Here I'm choking on my tears while he seems to be having the time of his life. Three weeks ago I was "the love of his life" and he planned a future with me. Now he's taking pictures while kissing her. He would barely take such pictures of us like that (although we have one almost identical to the one he took with her now), let alone letting me share them online (because no one should know about me, right?!). It's not that I want to begrudge him his happiness (or whatever it is that he feels with her/without me) or ruin his life. It's how he makes me feel like I don't exist. It's how he makes me feel voiceless and invisible and belittles my intelligence. That what hurts the most.

OK, I've allowed it to happen and I take full responsibility for that, but why is he allowed to walk out on the damage that he causes over and over again? Is nobody supposed to know how destructive he has been with me? Don't I deserve any kind of recognition? I have never and am still not asking for anything of him, but only for his family to know what he and I have been up to during these past five years, that there was a time we planned our future, a home and children, that I exist and have loved him unconditionally and wholeheartedly for so long. I truly hate to talk like this about myself, but I've seriously put in my heart and soul into this relationship. I gave it the best of me and the most vital years of my life. And in the end, I'm thrown like a bone to a dog? It's how he thinks he's entitled to leave me hanging without a closure and pretend that he's sorry or that I'm speaking a foreign language when I confront him, making me feel plain stupid. It's like committing a carefully planned out crime and leaving no trace for others to be figured out. I gave this my all, yet I don't exist either to him or his entourage. I don't want to be that stupid person any more. My silence might continue to make me look like I'm unaware of what he's doing, like what he's doing is okay and the cycle will continue, maybe not with me but with others. Where's the sense in that? Where's the justice in all of this? It's so unfair this life, you know..

freyja wrote:KEY POINTS TO REMEMBER

1. An abusive man’s emotional problems do not cause his abusiveness. You can’t change him by figuring out what is bothering him, helping him feel better, or improving the dynamics of your relationship.

2.Feelings do not govern abusive or controlling behavior; beliefs, values, and habits are the driving forces.

3.The reasons that an abusive man gives for his behavior are simply excuses. There is no way to overcome a problem with abusiveness by focusing on tangents such as self-esteem, conflict resolution, anger management, or impulse control. Abusiveness is resolved by dealing with abusiveness.

4. Abusers thrive on creating confusion, including confusion about the abuse itself.

5. There is nothing wrong with you. Your partner’s abuse problem is his own

I will keep this in mind. Thank you for your support, really. I've learned so much from this forum and everyone here and it's all I have in terms of dealing openly with this issue. Thank you all!

***

It's how he makes me feel like I don't exist. It's how he makes me feel voiceless and invisible and belittles my intelligence. That what hurts the most.

Miriam,

Your ex ran you through the mill, he played you, confused you and betrayed you and of course your head is still mixed up in all that.

Celia posted at the end of another current thread 7 tips on healing in the aftermath of one of these kinds of relationships. Have a look!

You've identified the main thoughts: "I don't exist, I am voiceless, I am invisible...", but how do you feel when you have those thoughts?

Hurt is a feeling but there is more to feelings like that when our needs are not being met. Try to write down your feelings, and then needs, and think of something you can do to address a need you have today, that if met could change how you feel even a little bit, that does not involve anyone in his life.

You've identified the main thoughts: "I don't exist, I am voiceless, I am invisible...", but how do you feel when you have those thoughts?

It doesn't make me feel voiceless and invisible as a person in a general sense, but only in how he treats me. I'm mostly battling with the question of how and why I let him do this to me again and again. It's hard to explain without writing too much. In short, I've always handled previous relationships differently. He is the only one that crossed all my boundaries while I was watching. I'm working on figuring out why I allowed this, with him only...

Hurt is a feeling but there is more to feelings like that when our needs are not being met. Try to write down your feelings, and then needs, and think of something you can do to address a need you have today, that if met could change how you feel even a little bit, that does not involve anyone in his life.

Do you mean that it could be that my needs are not being met in other aspects of life and that that is why I've enabled/allowed this destructive relationship/behaviour?

***