Loving Mr Spock

I read this by Barbara Jacobs but couldn't relate very much (and not just because she is writing about her AS boyfriend)

If any of you have read it, did you think he was slightly bipolar with AS traits or can AS mimic bipolar?

hi topaz,

that was actually the first book i read about AS. i found it in my local oxfam, and because a friend's wife had suggested i might have it, i bought the book, more out of curiosity than anything else.

i do get where you're coming from when you say you couldn't relate to it. but i think that danny's main problem was his self-medicating with alcohol. i don't do that. also, another feature of his life was what he referred to as 'the game'. i don't do that either. however, what i certainly could relate to was the theraputic effect that driving has, and the desire to avoid conflict too that was so much a part of danny's character. also, to a certain extent, i do understand why he just disappeared. he just couldn't face up to trying to resolve the problems in his relationship with the author and disappearing was just another way of avoiding that conflict.

but what i most got out of this book was the way the author went to some trouble to explain the characteristics of AS. prior to reading that book i'd done some searches on the web and found nothing particularly compelling. post, i felt i could relate to the symptoms of AS, and perhaps most importantly, it was blatantly obvious that i scored very highly on the self-test that was included. so, i started reading more widely and started finding more and more stuff that really hit home with me.

so, i have to say that i'm grateful to barbara jocob's for writing her book. it was the one that openned my eyes to AS.

shock_the_monkey.

PS: i nearly forgot. no, i don't think danny was bi-polar (manic depressive).

I just think the guy had a lot more going on than just AS.

His chaotic lifestyle for one. Also, his mother's ominous statement when they first got together which implied he made a habit of moving in with women, spending their money and then dumping them.

I also wonder if the author ever tried to find out what happened to him. He just 'disappeared' but what if something had happened to him on one of his drunken binges?

I think if a NT wanted an insight into Aspergers and read this book they would likely run a mile before getting involved. I am doubtful about the accuracy because she lived with him for a relatively short time following a holiday romance. He never had a dx and neither did he seek to find out what was causing his turbulent lifestyle. He had traits of AS without a doubt but.... I also think he had traits of a lot more too.

Glad I read it anyway.

hi topaz,

i think we all have 'other stuff' going on in our lives. my uncle was manic depressive (bi-polar). i suffer from severe depression, which i'm convinced is genetic. it's hard, if not impossible, to separate the depression that i have from this 'source' from the depression i have from AS, which itself, i believe, is also genetic.

i think danny was basically an alcoholic. that's a pretty serious condition in itself, which leads to seriously aberant behavior too. but i'm fairly certain that this was indeed a form of self-medication because of his AS.

however, i think you've actually got the bit about him spending the money of the women he had relationships with the wong way around. i think the author made it very clear that her attraction to him was his child-like quality. i've no doubt the women that were attracted to him all wanted to mother him and were quite willing to lavish their money on him to achieve this aim. all part of that 'loving too much' stuff i mentioned previously. overall, when the chips were down and these women wanted a more balanced relationship, danny just wasn't capable of giving that. and that's why his relationship had the same pattern to them, whereby he ultimately fled to avoid the intimacy he was incapable of and the ensuing conflict this cause that he couldn't stand.

obviously, that's my view but i think it's not far from the truth.

shock_the_monkey.

Sure, we all have other things going on so I don't disagree with you on that. . . I just have doubts that AS was the main cause of the difficulty in the relationship and yet the theme of the book seemed to be saying this is how living with someone with Asperger is like.

His chaotic lifestyle, promiscuity, binge alcoholism, lack of responsibility, direction and overall instability was seemingly put down to Asperger and the reason she couldn't tolerate it. Whereas, his AS traits - innocence, childlike behaviour and so on were hardly causing her any problems. He also appeared quite extroverted, in fact, more extroverted than the author who seemed to enjoy more sedate pursuits. (I found him manic which is why I thought he was bipolar)

Maybe I am wrong and her account is typical but It would be interesting to read more 1st hand accounts of what it is like for an NT to live with an AS partner.

hi topaz,

i think you're right that dann's behaviour isn't typical of AS. but neither is alcholism. and i think the thinks you identify as aberant within that context ("chaotic lifestyle, promiscuity, binge alcoholism, lack of responsibility, direction and overall instability ") all, to my mind, centre on that one aspect, which may well have been a response to the anxiety created by his AS.

but i honestly didn't read his behaviour as manic depressive. i think the depressive element, as i would understand it was conspicuous by its absense. people, to my mind, often have a distorted view of what constitutes depression. they may indeed claim to be depressed when they're merely sad or run down. depression is far more debilitating than that. however, i can see how the excesses of alcoholism migh be confused with mania.

shock_the_monkey.

I think Danny May have had A.S. But was also a psychopath. Just as I have realised that I am literal and sometimes, if I realise it, can play on it with humour. I think Danny would sometimes realise that he had blundered and play it. This incite comes painfully for me, I went out with a psychopath who pretended to have A.S. He showed me a website showing me A.S characteristics, top of the list.... Honesty (he was anything but) in the end, he took great delight in taking off his mask and revealing his true identity, to show me how badly he had taken me in, it cost me my mental health and my child went into care for a while. I now feel that in a way this was a good thing, it allowed us both to get completely over him.

I think for Danny his A.S. Made him need a mentor but his psychopathy, demanded someone forgiving and generous to a fault. Who, still gives a new sofa to someone who has disappeared for the night with 4 women, the reason he didn't want her at the night club was because he obviously had another women and didn't want there paths to cross. He gave her £200 and saw her off at the train station because he realised he was losing control of his sugar momma!!! He finally left when she kicked his car and started costing him money. If she had invested in her self and not let him financially abuse her, he would have left a lot earlier. I have the most utter respect for Barbara, for laying her life out so candidly and I think she makes some outstanding points about his A.S. Symptoms especially the dissociation in loud bars, I never understood that before. However I worry that Barbara would still let him back in her life, she needs to look at some of the symptoms of psychopathic behaviour, such as charisma and glib surface charm. It was only when he was really drunk that the mask slipped and his true malice shone through.... Where is there any real sense of remorse just shallow empty words to pull her back In again. If you ever see this Barbara you are obviously a lovely women, but you need to take more care of you!! My ex was called Dan, they are about the same age, I did wonder.

I've not read or heard of this book. But he sounds a lot like someone I once knew. Who had PDA (pathological demand avoidance) diagnosed, drink problem, drug problem, criminal record (due to "surviving" apparently), and probably some other pd (non diagnosed).

He and I had a lot in common with the autism traits. But he lied alot to avoid conflict. badly, but he lied. So with that in mind, and everything else, no. I would never say he had Asperger's. Funnily enough, he also did a disappearing trick with no thought for the people he left behind. But then rocked back up years later out of the blue when he needed to, with a cheeky grin. Cheek indeed.

If I had said to him that he was Mr Spock he would've laughed in my face. He would've said "I'm not like anyone, I'm one of a kind. I don't lead and I don't follow. I make my own rules and trust noone." He was very paranoid.

However I'm not a male aspie, so this is just what OP wrote reminded me of.

it's been a long time since i read this and so my memory is now fairly vague. however, the impression i got was that the author mistook trying to nurture someone for a romantic interest. i actually think that's very common with NT women and AS men. danny, the author's boyfriend, only ever came across to me as being very emotionally immature. i never got the impression that he was a psychopath. but i think it's easy to confuse the two. the main difference to me is that of intent. danny was just too hapless to have had any real intent. and in the story the author never revealed him as really having any either. he seemed to drift out of her life as aimlessly as he drifted in.

I wrote what I said after having a near meltdown as I read how Barbara had still paid for Danny's sofa after he went off with four women. With my ex the A.S symptoms were obviously authentic which is why I tried so hard with him and of course he manipulated this to his own advantage. There were many times though,when he seemed less than authentic and at the time I gave myself a hard time for doubting him. However now after the big reveal I realise that that was the time he was playing his own game.

Danny in the book comes over as being very affectionate on several occasions I would think that this would be very hard to authentically replicate and as Barbara is obviously a good reader of body language, maybe she is right about him. If I had listened to my intuition, rather than my guilt, there would have been a lot better outcome for my family I guess Barbara's intuition said she thought him to be a good guy. So I apologise for imposing my own bitterness on the situation.