MikeAngel...

look I was right:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/artic ... -side.html

see women don't really want feminism, as it is destructive to them too!

the only reason women are competing with men is because that's what they've been taught to do, and women are conformists (the composition of the prison population will attest) much more so than men and so they conform to the ideology of feminism disseminated by the state (via education, media, and parental role modelling) for the purpose of national productivity in order gain approval...but it's not what they want and it destroys them...

I think this article, while discussing a particular issue, touches on the whole issue of women working and striving for gender equality...

"We honestly believed that if we worked hard, we could have it all and more.

Yet so many of us have ended up lonely, exhausted and broken-hearted, with far less of what we bargained for."

SO MIKE

DON'T HATE WOMEN

THEY ARE MISGUIDED

BUT THEY ARE REALIZING THIS AND WITH YOUR HELP THEY CAN BREAK FROM THE IDEOLOGY OF FEMINISM WHICH EXPLOITS THEM TO INCREASE NATIONAL PRODUCTIVITY

as I've been arguing all along, and which the newest research is now demonstrating...

self-aggrandizing rant (skip over):

Dear Diary,

is it just me, or do I have the ability to predict the future?

for years now I have been monitoring the state of society in the shadows, as a wolf in sheep's clothing...

and the objectivity that this perspective has lent me has allowed me to predict the future, and afforded me insight into human nature...

Is it my destiny to provoke a revolution, to empower men to reclaim control of their labour, women, and children, and once again love and provide for all those and that which they love and cherish?

Dear Diary...so long as there is a breath remaining in my body I will bring global capitalism and modernity to its knees and free the people from state control. I will show them that death is nothing to fear, and that living half as long as we do now in freedom and self-governance in small villages or towns IS the way to happiness, not the oppression for the sake of luxuries and safety and longevity that is modern life...these things do not matter if one must sell their soul and become alienated from one's self for their procurement

MIKE! HEAR MY WORDS LIKE THUNDER!

STOP COMPETING WITH YOUR FELLOW MEN AND WOMEN AND CHILDREN!

BE A MAN, AND FREE THEM FROM MODERN LIFE

THIS IS WHAT IS MEANS TO BE A MAN. IT IS TO TAKE CONTROL AND ACT ACCORDING TO ONE'S TRUE NATURE

IF IT DOESN'T FEEL RIGHT, IT'S NOT RIGHT! DON'T INTELLECTUALIZE IT!!!!

You should present your thesis to the folks at FoxNews. I bet Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter would love you, Crys.

Or would that be Cameron and the folks at the Sun?

I learned something from this article...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1039030/Fast-track-femininity-Why-competing-men-left-women-touch-feminine-side.html wrote:'If it feels false, don't do it.'

so for a woman, being in balance with yourself is about wearing more girly clothes, getting botox done, flirting with everyone and wearing more makeup... damn, i knew i was doing something wrong, i should quit therapy right now and go get my nails done

Xena,

lol, the media has an interest in maintaining the status quo.

I'm not going public with this because I don't want to run the risk of being labelled as a delusional anti-feminist just yet...

it's so easy to have a dissenting voice such as mine silenced, and if I am publicly discredited as a person then its left to others to carry out the needed revolution back to a previous way of life...as I will be rendered a lunatic or something

image is important in politics and I need to be strategic about disseminating radical views and organizing people - WITHOUT being labelled a nut case..

even the word 'radical' is off-putting for people, no matter how reasonable and common sense the message. the media could just label me a radical and I'd be done. that's how fickle human perception is.

plus, where I live feminism has just taken hold and women have yet to realize the pitfalls and how they are being manipulated for the sake of productivity.

not even women in the uk - a nation far more mature and ahead in the 'race' toward gender equality than my own - have fully realized the pitfalls of feminism to our society...as well as the pitfalls of the structures feminism supports (modernity, global capitalism, state surveillance and control, etc)

if you read the article, the women is not saying 'women should forget about their careers and fully embrace their femininity and traditional values and roles', she is suggesting that women need to more balance in their lives

this is progress, but she's falling short of the full realization that so long as our nation holds productivity above happiness as a value, women will not have the choice to not work like men (which is ironic, given the message of feminism - 'freedom of choice'). our society is not currently designed for women to all of a sudden regress to traditional gender roles. current policy is predicated on the assumption that more not less women will enter the workforce...

in other words, these issues are part of bigger issues. modern society is characterized by boom and bust cycles, frequent recessions and all that. men cannot be relied on as sole providers (even though this is what women AND men want) because they have no control over their labour and are subject to downturns in the economy and just general insecurity in work under modern capitalism. if women pull out of the economy they'll have no one to support them

hence the need to get rid of the state, and get rid of global capitalism in order to just REDUCE the scale of society into small self-sufficient, self-governed villages where men have control over their labour - guaranteed esteemed work - and women can respect and rely on men to provide for them.

it's just the way it's meant to be, and progressivism is a euphemism for 'I'm an idiot and I think we should do the opposite of what's felt natural and right for all of human evolution...'

BE A MAN, AND FREE THEM FROM MODERN LIFE

THIS IS WHAT IS MEANS TO BE A MAN. IT IS TO TAKE CONTROL AND ACT ACCORDING TO ONE'S TRUE NATURE

Helping others in not my true nature.

Sorry for such a short reply, I'm tired and skimmed over your post. I'll post a more intellectually stimulating reply when I awake.

katana wrote:I learned something from this article...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1039030/Fast-track-femininity-Why-competing-men-left-women-touch-feminine-side.html wrote:'If it feels false, don't do it.'

so for a woman, being in balance with yourself is about wearing more girly clothes, getting botox done, flirting with everyone and wearing more makeup... damn, i knew i was doing something wrong, i should quit therapy right now and go get my nails done

that definition of femininity is stereotypical and excessive, but being feminine has always meant taking care of yourself, treating yourself to 'softer' things.

that's the message.

so more or less, yes, go get your damn nails done you deserve it girl


also, me and you have been raised to value competence over nurturance, so treating our selves to these 'softer' things is somewhat unfamiliar to us.

when I was 15 my parents were going to throw me away on the streets and never wanted to see me again for low grades - I wasn't even failing, just low grades.

your parents similarly made their 'love' conditional on work competence - which is what men traditionally derive their self-esteem from, not women

so being vulnerable and not in control - i.e. feminine - is somewhat unfamiliar to us and we are inclined to balk at these sorts of things, but my whole argument pressuposes that expectations in society for men and women today (supported by parents..) would be different - more traditional.

thus we (in theory) would be different..maybe. I think tomboyishness is partly genetic (although relatively rare) so it's not always socialization...

-- Sat Aug 18, 2012 1:17 am --

MikeAngel wrote:

BE A MAN, AND FREE THEM FROM MODERN LIFE

THIS IS WHAT IS MEANS TO BE A MAN. IT IS TO TAKE CONTROL AND ACT ACCORDING TO ONE'S TRUE NATURE

Helping others in not my true nature.

Sorry for such a short reply, I'm tired and skimmed over your post. I'll post a more intellectually stimulating reply when I awake.

no problemo.

sleep tight

I don't see it Crys. If the emphasis in your ideal society is on Patriarchy caring for the women, what you're suggesting sounds less like socialism or anarcho-syndicalism, and more like a pastoral nomad society. (Or a Quiverfull household.) Not exactly my idea of a good time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S10vsKRS2e8

Xena, have you seen the movie, The Village?

I mean something like that (expect for all the spooky stuff)

edit:
I don't want to defend my notion of an ideal society in this thread because I have in many threads before and it gets repetitive and just derails the thread...

my message is primarily that women are not to blame, that they are being manipulated (like men) under modern capitalism. and feminism is the means.

I'll have to see if I can get The Village on Netflix. I haven't seen it.

I still don't see feminism as destructive. Even in a society without Big Government, s/he who controls the means of production controls his/her own destiny. S/he who has the tools and the skills to keep the bad stuff out of the home rules the roost, as it were. I've never been comfortable with leaving somebody else in charge of my home.

Yeah, neo-con capitalism sux, but given a choice, I'd rather be able to hoe my own row and row my own hoe in whichever society I have to live in. If the apocalypse were to hit us tomorrow, I'd rather be this lady

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nftBKAti ... re=related

than this one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgLy3Lh0 ... re=related

There are plenty of men who enjoy relationships with partners who are their equals. Some even enjoy being House Husbands. And many men and women choose to opt out of hookup culture altogether. It's kinda silly for women to blame their datelessness on feminism when there's a world of options out there.

If the author of your article wants to reject everything about herself that this guy finds 'too masculine', that's her perogative. If I were in her position, I'd seriously consider finding a less critical man. Guys who use vague excuses like 'not feminine enough' are usually just looking for excuses to ditch a commitment. If not now, then 10 years from now when the lady suddenly becomes 'too old' or 'too fat' or whatever.

Hey Brenda, I thought you'd gone to start your new life...

Didn't work out, or was your 'new life' one of the handful of alts that have popped up the last few days?